Sports and Politics. Do they mix?

[Cornuck]

New thread for anyone who wants to delve deeper into the topic

[donlever]

...the only sort of situation I would see that as tolerable would be (as an example) Ukrainians booing the Russian anthem.

So, it's OK to boo if the country whose anthem you are booing is pursuing a policy of forced annexation of your country?

Check.

No. It's understandable to boo if said country is pursuing that via military assault that is resulting in the bombing of infrastructure and the loss of civilian lives.

Right now we are talking about booing the anthem of our longest and closest ally simply because they elected a crass asshole who is pandering to nationalism and making America strong (not saying he's succeeding, just that that is his rhetoric).

Should Conservative voters boo our own anthem because more ridings elected a Liberal government for the past (almost) 12 years that has driven our economy into the ditch and exercised wedge politics to divide people along multiple opinion lines?

[Megaterio Llamas]

In my opiinion, no, they don't. Not in a serious way.

The first thing I would like to do is to get the Russians back into hockey tournaments.

[Cousin Strawberry]

It used to be the Russians that were the mercenary types that only wanted to play in LA, FLA or NYC to chase cups in cool places to live. How many Canadians have shunned Canadian franchises for this and that reason. Now it's the Americans.

Maybe they're just young, wealthy and really don't give a fuck what we think

[donlever]

"Some" Americans.

Not:

Buium
Demko
Boeser
Hutson
Connor
Matthews
Sanderson
Pinto
Wolf
Caulfield

Spades are spades.

Edit: annnnnddd, for sake of argument, JT Miller.

[Cousin Strawberry]

Some indeed. Corrected

[Ronning's Ghost]

Right now we are talking about booing the anthem of our longest and closest ally simply because they elected a crass asshole who is pandering to nationalism and making America strong (not saying he's succeeding, just that that is his rhetoric).

It wouldn't be, but that's not what he said he was doing. He said he wanted to use economic force to compel the annexation of Canada, and forced annexation is the line.

Did he really mean it? There has been a cottage industry in trying to cipher what Trump really means, and I'm not certain he knows himself, but that's what he said.

And for me, yeah, a direct, explicit threat to our continued existence is enough.

Edit: sorry, I originally missed the quote nest, and misattributed the comment.
I don't know whether Lever was seconding the comment, or just facilitating the process of moving the discussion.

Another edit: this might just be somebody's Canadian history thesis, but I would argue that Canada's longest and closest ally has been Great Britain. You know, the kingdom we share a king with.

[UWSaint]

More on this topic buried in the international hockey forum: https://www.canuckscorner.com/forums/vi ... 65#p603565, but replies should go to this thread….

[donlever]

Lever wasn't seconding anything...a facilitator is all.

[rikster]

It used to be the Russians that were the mercenary types that only wanted to play in LA, FLA or NYC to chase cups in cool places to live. How many Canadians have shunned Canadian franchises for this and that reason. Now it's the Americans.

Maybe they're just young, wealthy and really don't give a fuck what we think

I agree and think its that simple...

Wealth is transient and in the NHL gone are the days where the majority of the players had to wait till they were 35 and still productive to $$ cash in and decide where they wanted to play, now they are becomming wealthy after 3 years in the league which allows them more say in where they play...

As for politics, I support the ban on Russia's national team and I don't have an issue with expressing anger towards a country whose leader's goal is to take over our country and think its overly liberal or Chamberlain to feel any other way...

After reading an indepth account of the behind scenes of Trumps attempts to take over Greenland I came away concerned that there were similar backroom attempts to take over Canada and wasn't overly surprised to hear that the Carney Government was preparing for an American invasion...

[Cornuck]

There's a long history here of boycotts and other things that weave international politics into sports.

1936 Olympics - The US was very close to boycotting, and ended up going and providing Jesse Owens a showcase for his talents (and poke a flaw in Hitler's master race theory).

Other Olympic boycotts happened because of countries' 'transgressions' 1956, 1976 (29 African countries boycotted the Montreal games), 1980 (Russia invades Afghanistan), 1984 (Soviets boycott LA games in retaliation). I'm actually surprised there are not more international boycotts.

Now we have Russia - they invaded Ukraine (we all know that), and there are a lot of economic sanctions against them. Why should sports be exempt? To me, it's a punishment for the country doing something horrible. Why give the easy out, and just say, "It's only sports? Sports should unite us." - Individual Russians can be free to do what they want (as far as playing in the NHL, etc) - but I don't see why we should let them have a national presence in tournaments.

The same should also go for any country that invades another.

Now, when it comes to something like booing a national anthem, to me (and others have said), it gives the individual a voice to express opposition to that country's policies. Would you boo the Russian national anthem? We have freedom of speech for a reason. If the leader of a country expresses a desire to take over Canada (whether trolling or not), don't Canadians have the right to publicly express displeasure at that leader? I would hope that any American player who hears this would have the basic civics understanding to figure out what's going on. It may be uncomfortable, but I think they can handle it.

A little booing is small potatoes compared to storming an embassy or taking other action. Boycott American products, don't visit the country and do what you like - booing the anthem is just another way of expressing your opinion.

[5thhorseman]

The same should also go for any country that invades another.

Let's ban the US for invading Venezuela then.

Unless they don't count because they're third-world/socialist/brown

[UWSaint]

There's a long history here of boycotts and other things that weave international politics into sports.

...

Now, when it comes to something like booing a national anthem, to me (and others have said), it gives the individual a voice to express opposition to that country's policies. Would you boo the Russian national anthem? We have freedom of speech for a reason.

When a country bans its athletes from participating in an event (a boycott), it is the country conducting international affairs at the expense of sport. Countries do international affairs. That presents much different issues than an NGO banning a country from participating for that nation's (or that nation's athletes) politics. That's the NGO conducting international affairs at the expense of sports. That NGO does sport.

Individual fans booing at flags and anthems and athletes at sporting events (because of their national affiliation), that presents a slightly different issue than either of the above, but has one thing in common with the NGO/event host bans: it is ineffective towards any political end.

As for free speech, I've never taken the position that people can't boo the US Flag and anthem at a game. This discussion isn't about free speech, the fact that one may do something is a lot different than the question about whether one should. Free speech is a total diversion to what's being discussed.

[UWSaint]

As for politics, I support the ban on Russia's national team and I don't have an issue with expressing anger towards a country whose leader's goal is to take over our country and think its overly liberal or Chamberlain to feel any other way...

I think Russia is gonna take over my country.

I'm angry about it.

I'll express that anger by spitting on the next Russian I see.

Is there an issue?

Chamberlain! Because Hitler! And Putin! And Trump! So very clever, Rikster!

How about a ban on all Russian's from entering the country, forget the sporting event? Why or why not, and how does your answer apply to the question of sport and politics.