The Petey Predicament

[Cousin Strawberry]

He had to have some sort of freak level strength in those pipe cleaners to blast 100+ MPH slappers though. He could do shit that he shouldn't have been able to do

I think some posters here are onto something with this. Did the coaching and weirdo teammates just ruin him?

[donlever]

The poor poor boy....

....little dudes hit golf balls miles...not about biceps.

[Cousin Strawberry]

The poor poor boy....

....little dudes hit golf balls miles...not about biceps.

I've never seen a little dude have the hardest shot against the best big dudes who can shoot in the world though.

[Carl Yagro]

Here we go again... Cuz is ball-washing scooter's dimpled Pinnacles.

It's technique and technology.

Little guys like Ronning were hammering shots with wooden Sherwood PMP 5030s. Naslund was firing lasers, also with wood.

The composite one-piece tech in the last 20-30 years has made everybody better and easily added speed. 13yo can shatter glass now like Happy Gilmore.

Even a muffin-baker like me probably added at least 10-15 mph from wood to 2-piece to today's 1-piece lightweight composites.

Scooter is nothing special... especially without JTM or Hughes putting it into his wheelhouse on the PP.

Ya damn scooter rider

[Cousin Strawberry]

Then why aren't all the hardest shooters scrawny scooters then?

Why is he the ONLY one who did this???

[Meds]

Then why aren't all the hardest shooters scrawny scooters then?

Why is he the ONLY one who did this???

It has more to do with height and technique. The last 10 have all been at least 6'2", with the exception of Makar.

[Topper]

The poor poor boy....

....little dudes hit golf balls miles...not about biceps.

I've never seen a little dude have the hardest shot against the best big dudes who can shoot in the world though.

You sound like his wife

[Topper]

C'mon UW...love your point counterpoint and respect the fuck out of you but you're a hockey guy, the kid was a waif, elfin like...

...he had to bulk up and gain some strength.

He might have broken in two had he not.

Small and narrow framed indeed.


Screenshot_20260511-182707_Chrome.jpg

If only to stay upright on his skates

[Madcombinepilot]

There is a lot of petey hate here.

The kid is gonna get traded for 3 assets, and will rocket back up to 90-100 points on another team. He is simply in his own head here. If he had some talent to play with, and started to have fun playing the game again, he would return to the player he was. You can’t forget talent.

But here in Vancouver, he will be lucky to get 70 points and the toxic environment (fans and media) will continue to be A factor affecting his play.

[UWSaint]

You can’t forget talent.

(1) You can lose talent. Injury, age, lack of practice/drilling it. I played guitar for years in bands that played out, and an off night would be being out of sync a bit with the drummer or bass player. It was never bum notes. Why? Practice and routine. You aren't even thinking about it. Now? I can try to play the same things, and its full of bum notes or things that I can't pull off anymore. Why? Of course I don't play nearly as much, but on top of that that, when I do play, I am just fucking around to make (sometimes pleasing) noise, not drilling technique. Does EP40 drill shooting, puck handling/control, skating like he did when he was a developing rink rat, or did he think "I've got that."

(2) You can also fail to exploit your own talent. That's the head case explanation. Whether its external or internal -- doesn't really matter, because only internal changes change it.

(3) Or you can be in a system/situation that doesn't open up your talent as it once was.

I think all of this is happening for EP40, but changing (3) [say, better linemates and a style of play that is aligned with his strengths] won't amount to much unless whatever from (1) and (2) that can be addressed are addressed. Because while (3) might affect cumulative production over the course of the season, we have all seen snapshots where that stuff (style of play, linemates) doesn't matter in that instant and EP40 isn't effective in a way that he once was.

[Madcombinepilot]

You can’t forget talent.

(1) You can lose talent. Injury, age, lack of practice/drilling it. I played guitar for years in bands that played out, and an off night would be being out of sync a bit with the drummer or bass player. It was never bum notes. Why? Practice and routine. You aren't even thinking about it. Now? I can try to play the same things, and its full of bum notes or things that I can't pull off anymore. Why? Of course I don't play nearly as much, but on top of that that, when I do play, I am just fucking around to make (sometimes pleasing) noise, not drilling technique. Does EP40 drill shooting, puck handling/control, skating like he did when he was a developing rink rat, or did he think "I've got that."

(2) You can also fail to exploit your own talent. That's the head case explanation. Whether its external or internal -- doesn't really matter, because only internal changes change it.

(3) Or you can be in a system/situation that doesn't open up your talent as it once was.

I think all of this is happening for EP40, but changing (3) [say, better linemates and a style of play that is aligned with his strengths] won't amount to much unless whatever from (1) and (2) that can be addressed are addressed. Because while (3) might affect cumulative production over the course of the season, we have all seen snapshots where that stuff (style of play, linemates) doesn't matter in that instant and EP40 isn't effective in a way that he once was.

Fair enough on the points.
But in the middle of your career, had you joined a band that was fun, and you loved the music and the band bus, and the vibe was jammin and the booze, drugs and women were flowing (or whatever you made you mojo go), and showing off made all three of those things happen at a higher level, I bet you could have stepped right back up. --See Mick Mars.

I am saying the guy gets a lot of hate here, and probably deservedly so. That doesn't make him a horrible human or even a horrible hockey player.

Just makes him uninspired as a Vancouver Canuck.

[Topper]

Scooter will be told that holding out for more money than Nylander and signing one of the highest paying contracts in the league at the time comes with the responsibility of showing up in camp prepared for the season.

That will teach him.

[UWSaint]

Scooter will be told that holding out for more money than Nylander and signing one of the highest paying contracts in the league at the time comes with the responsibility of showing up in camp prepared for the season.

That will teach him.

Nothing teaches EP40 directly, at least that's how it appears from the outside. He's resistant to being told what to do. I don't think its because he couldn't care less (though could be), I think its because he's constantly self-analyzing and that in that process he rejects the direction/advice he receives that he's already rationalized wouldn't work or he's already tried and didn't work. I've known many people in my life who are like this, some come around and realize building barriers to others isn't helping, some never come around to that but figure it out, some continue to flounder.

I don't think particular external "strategies" have tremendously different outcomes with people like this, except to say that the *least* successful is probably micromanaging their time and efforts because it is the think that's likely to result in the most direct opposition. That stuff works great for people asking for solutions for the person providing the plan, but it is not effective people who think they can come up with the answers and/or think they know more about what the problems are than the person giving the plan.

"You are responsible for coming to camp prepared" is also not very well calibrated to improve EP40, but its not going to create opposition that wasn't there. I actually thought the most effective message for a player like Petey in that press conference was the Sedins saying "we didn't always do what we should, and that showed in our performance. And when we did improve our offseason training, that led to results." Its a couple of hall of famers with successful careers admitting to a failure that I don't recall them ever admitting to before (maybe a made up story -- but honestly, their development was slow and they went from Sedin-falls-have-a-drink to a couple of the strongest guys on their skates in the league once they developed offseason training regiments that dramatically improved their core and lower body strength). This is the kind of story that works better on the Petey personality (if I have him correctly pegged) than a simpler "our success was because we were prepared" message because it contains darkness and then a light at the end of a tunnel.

The other way to go at the Petey personality -- beyond shifting that personality with effective (tough ask) therapy which only works if EP40 is receptive to it (tough ask) -- is the hero card. This team needs you, its yours now, it rises and falls on your shoulders, only you can make it successful. This is different than the "expectation" message. Its crude bro psychology, but many men are most motivated by and do their best work when they feel they are indispensably needed and then they go about and fill that need. To be sure, some flail under that message. More importantly, it is a little incoherent in given where the Canucks sit -- where management just said that "success" isn't going to be measured by wins and losses in the near term. So that message is unlikely to resonate now because EP40 won't believe it....

[Topper]

To counter UW.

1 - The Sedins have been involved with Scooter since he was drafted

2 - Scooter demanded the contract he has as the teams MVP, then decided the responsibility wasn't his.

[UWSaint]

To counter UW.

1 - The Sedins have been involved with Scooter since he was drafted

2 - Scooter demanded the contract he has as the teams MVP, then decided the responsibility wasn't his.

Point one -- taken, agreed, and I accept the implications. You may recall the thread Donny started about the Sedins a year or two ago, and I was not exactly impressed with the management/player development Sedins for all the unstated reasons you imply in this point.

On the second point, the bro psychology point I am making isn't about the motivation of taking responsibility because its the tradeoff in a deal. Its about being told you are indispensably needed and then you ride in to save the damsel. Two very different types of motivation. When EP40 got the bag, Hughes was the captain, JT acted like he was in charge, Tochett was taking away EP40s toys, the message he was likely hearing (whether said directly or not) was "you've got the bag, now earn it," not "help me Obi-Wan, you're are only hope."