The Rebuild...

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Iceman2014
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Re: The Rebuild...

Post by Iceman2014 »

RoyalDude wrote:In hindsight a full gut rebuild should have started after the 2011-2012 season, the product was dead at that point.

This organization is heading backwards to that ugly era of Canuck hockey prior to the fat drunken Irishman - QUINN taking a blow torch to the organization. Community Legend - Trevor Linden, the town mayor, is helping to speed up that process.

Come join Club 16!
Uuuuuuuuuh...rebuild the team after going to game 7 of the Finals? Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight. I desperately want a rebuild right now but there is no way anybody would've wanted a rebuild right after the year the Canucks went to game 7. No chance.

I totally agree they should've started parting ways with a couple of older vets here and there and turning them into high picks or high end assets. That should always be going on. It's how a team avoids an epic collapse...like the one we're having now.

I am hoping ownership is finally understanding this team will not make the playoffs and nobody believes they'll make the playoffs. Even if they are a bubble team, they will be bounced in round 1. I think most fans agree with that. Those fans see no hope in the current direction (compete now and get into playoffs).

If Benning brought in some more young, high end talent then I'd be way more on board. I'd have hope. I would be very interested. Right now my biggest interest is hoping Benning trades Tanev, Hansen and Edler for high end, young talent and high draft picks. The product on the ice doesn't do much for me. I still watch and hope the kids turn into something. I think they will but that always takes time.
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Re: The Rebuild...

Post by Cornuck »

If Linden had to convince the Aquas to do a full tear down and rebuild, he would have had to have convinced them of the long term investment and how it would pay off. He had to make a case that the empty seats in the next year or two would have been a viable loss to ensure full seats within a few years - and then laid out his plan how his rebuild would have progressed.

I'm guessing he didn't make much of a case and was told to spend to the cap, win games and rebuild on the fly - and now we might looking at a half empty arena for the next 5-6 years.

As for the Sedins, I've always been a supported and have said that I want them back after their contracts are up. Based on how this season is starting, I'm starting to change my mind. The Twinsition™ might be short lived.

If we need to get rid of one either Tanev or Edler, I'm hoping Edler will waive and we can make a deal. Either way, we need help scoring - not just perimeter shots on goal, but a new way of playing that we haven't seen for a long time. The pass first mentality worked well when we had the personnel to make it happen, but now it's just sad to watch.

Go Bo Go!
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Chef Boi RD
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Re: The Rebuild...

Post by Chef Boi RD »

Iceman2014 wrote:
RoyalDude wrote:In hindsight a full gut rebuild should have started after the 2011-2012 season, the product was dead at that point.

This organization is heading backwards to that ugly era of Canuck hockey prior to the fat drunken Irishman - QUINN taking a blow torch to the organization. Community Legend - Trevor Linden, the town mayor, is helping to speed up that process.

Come join Club 16!
Uuuuuuuuuh...rebuild the team after going to game 7 of the Finals? Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight. I desperately want a rebuild right now but there is no way anybody would've wanted a rebuild right after the year the Canucks went to game 7. No chance.

I totally agree they should've started parting ways with a couple of older vets here and there and turning them into high picks or high end assets. That should always be going on. It's how a team avoids an epic collapse...like the one we're having now.

I am hoping ownership is finally understanding this team will not make the playoffs and nobody believes they'll make the playoffs. Even if they are a bubble team, they will be bounced in round 1. I think most fans agree with that. Those fans see no hope in the current direction (compete now and get into playoffs).

If Benning brought in some more young, high end talent then I'd be way more on board. I'd have hope. I would be very interested. Right now my biggest interest is hoping Benning trades Tanev, Hansen and Edler for high end, young talent and high draft picks. The product on the ice doesn't do much for me. I still watch and hope the kids turn into something. I think they will but that always takes time.
Dude, the 2011-2012 season I said, not the 2010-2011 season
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Chef Boi RD
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Re: The Rebuild...

Post by Chef Boi RD »

dangler wrote:Different scenarios Shannahon was hired first(before the gm & coach),hired his guys ,has a ownership board to answer to.
Linden was hired last (after the gm & coach) and has direct owners whom are also fans and understandedbly want a say in what happens to their investment on maybe a daily basis.
Trev does what he's told to do
wtf are you talking about? Linden hired Benning and it was basically him who hired Desjardins
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Re: The Rebuild...

Post by nuckster »

Cornuck wrote:If Linden had to convince the Aquas to do a full tear down and rebuild, he would have had to have convinced them of the long term investment and how it would pay off. He had to make a case that the empty seats in the next year or two would have been a viable loss to ensure full seats within a few years - and then laid out his plan how his rebuild would have progressed.

I'm guessing he didn't make much of a case and was told to spend to the cap, win games and rebuild on the fly - and now we might looking at a half empty arena for the next 5-6 years.

As for the Sedins, I've always been a supported and have said that I want them back after their contracts are up. Based on how this season is starting, I'm starting to change my mind. The Twinsition™ might be short lived.

If we need to get rid of one either Tanev or Edler, I'm hoping Edler will waive and we can make a deal. Either way, we need help scoring - not just perimeter shots on goal, but a new way of playing that we haven't seen for a long time. The pass first mentality worked well when we had the personnel to make it happen, but now it's just sad to watch.

Go Bo Go!
All good points. In all this dialogue, there's a failure to mention Benning and how he is performing. He gets a whole lot of 'rah rah' on this board and it's difficult to offer anything critical about him without being 'swarmed over' by outrage by the pro-Benning crowd. I've aready brought this up before, but consider this: we could be in a position right now where we have Nylander instead of Virtanen and Tkachuk instead of Juolevi. Nylander has been averaging close to a point a game, and Tkachuk is already on his way to becoming a bonafied scorer in the NHL. So, we could conceivably be looking at a future line of Nylander, Tkachuk, and Boeser when he comes aboard next year.

We were one of the lowest scoring teams last year, and ofcourse the Sedin due date was already upon us, and Benning opts to select a defenseman in the last draft who js a work in progress that will make the line-up in the future. I'm not slagging Juolevi, but where needs are concerned, the choice was quite a questionable one in my view. I know it's easy in hindsight to see the coulda shoulda view of things, but think how awesome it would be to have us sitting with Nylander and Tkachuk in our line-up right now as opposed to what we have. The fact we don't is due to Benning's particular kind of vision, a vision that hasn't assertively sought Sedin replacements for the future first line.

Having said all this, I'm not sure Tkachuk and Nylander would be given the kind of support they need to develop by W.D. and this would like ly be due to the philosophy of ownership and mgt to 'win-now' as opposed to putting the emphasis on youth and player development that has been talked about already. In Nylander's case, Toronto is obviously in the development 'groove', and though Calgary is in the 'win-now' groove, they have the offensive horses to do it and Tkachuk appears to be fitting in well. Like other's have mentioned already, there's real question marks about the climate/tone that is being generated by Mgt in Canuckland right now and whether or not it suits our status/reality? Truth be told we could be sitting in a different place, with a different mind-set, with a few different players perhaps, feeling a little more positive/excited about the future as opposed to what is unfolding right now.
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Re: The Rebuild...

Post by Island Nucklehead »

RoyalDude wrote:
dangler wrote:Different scenarios Shannahon was hired first(before the gm & coach),hired his guys ,has a ownership board to answer to.
Linden was hired last (after the gm & coach) and has direct owners whom are also fans and understandedbly want a say in what happens to their investment on maybe a daily basis.
Trev does what he's told to do
wtf are you talking about? Linden hired Benning and it was basically him who hired Desjardins
Was gonna say...

The Linden hire smells like all the hiring the Oilers did with their "old boys" network. He's a PR face/puppet for a muppet crew of owners. Instead of bringing in a "yes man" that makes for good publicity, maybe they should be bringing in experienced people that can build hockey franchises. Dale Tallon springs to mind.

RoyalDude wrote:In hindsight a full gut rebuild should have started after the 2011-2012 season, the product was dead at that point.
lol you're not gonna blow up a President's trophy winning team that had its leading scorer taken out by a dirty elbow leading into to the playoffs.

The dynamite should've been packed after the sweep by the Sharks. Even in a lockout year you could see the team wasn't going to get back to that 2011 level. A "Transition" might've made sense at that point, we might have some young guys helping the Sedins today... not now.
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Re: The Rebuild...

Post by Cousin Strawberry »

Buds we needed everything so taking the best player available will help regardless and most probably Juolevi ends up being twice the asset as Daniel Tkachuk. Puck moving Dmen like that are worth their weight in gold. Its just that we need forwards so desperately right this instant but DT wouldn't have helped this team short term anyway. I like the pick its just we needed 2 or 3 more 1st rounders last draft.
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Re: The Rebuild...

Post by Strangelove »

micky107 wrote:Long, long ago, I was absolutely chastised and ridiculed by my hockey friends.
Say it ain't so!! :D
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Re: The Rebuild...

Post by Strangelove »

nuckster wrote: Benning gets a whole lot of 'rah rah' on this board and it's difficult to offer anything critical about him without being 'swarmed over' by outrage by the pro-Benning crowd.
Yeahno, it's all in your mind bro (it's your own guilt haunting you for your mutinous ways).

You've convinced yourself Nylander/Tkachuk will turn out better than Virtanen/Juolevi.

Well good for you... JACK! 8-)
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Re: The Rebuild...

Post by Chef Boi RD »

Island Nucklehead wrote:
RoyalDude wrote:
dangler wrote:Different scenarios Shannahon was hired first(before the gm & coach),hired his guys ,has a ownership board to answer to.
Linden was hired last (after the gm & coach) and has direct owners whom are also fans and understandedbly want a say in what happens to their investment on maybe a daily basis.
Trev does what he's told to do
wtf are you talking about? Linden hired Benning and it was basically him who hired Desjardins
Was gonna say...

The Linden hire smells like all the hiring the Oilers did with their "old boys" network. He's a PR face/puppet for a muppet crew of owners. Instead of bringing in a "yes man" that makes for good publicity, maybe they should be bringing in experienced people that can build hockey franchises. Dale Tallon springs to mind.

RoyalDude wrote:In hindsight a full gut rebuild should have started after the 2011-2012 season, the product was dead at that point.
lol you're not gonna blow up a President's trophy winning team that had its leading scorer taken out by a dirty elbow leading into to the playoffs.

The dynamite should've been packed after the sweep by the Sharks. Even in a lockout year you could see the team wasn't going to get back to that 2011 level. A "Transition" might've made sense at that point, we might have some young guys helping the Sedins today... not now.
In hindsight Nucklefuck...hindsight!

Do we need to through the Canucks post season history from last season on back to the 2011 cup run? I don't know about you 20/20 but I see something fucking awful in that regards. Hindsight...as I said
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Re: The Rebuild...

Post by Island Nucklehead »

Mondi wrote: How good would the team look...with Boesser, Demko, and PATRICK in the lineup next season? Haha!
Honestly? Probably not much better.
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Re: The Rebuild...

Post by Chef Boi RD »

Island Nucklehead wrote:
Mondi wrote: How good would the team look...with Boesser, Demko, and PATRICK in the lineup next season? Haha!
Honestly? Probably not much better.
But ya gotta admit, win or lose, this city would be pretty fucking jacked about the future of this team? If we could draft Patrick? I could care less if we lost all 80 games next season. That means Jack Wise, Joseph Veleno or that Russian kid in 2018! Some folks are saying Wise is better than Eichel, and Veleno may be the best Canadian forward since McDavid
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Re: The Rebuild...

Post by 2Fingers »

I have been saying for years that you don't stick with the same team year after year, when the Nucks went to the finals and they were missing a key piece called an asshole the following season they did nothing about it. Too many fans get used to names on the back of shirts vs. the logo on the front. Tough decisions have to be made and the GM needs the balls to do it.

Edler should of been traded a few years ago.
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Re: The Rebuild...

Post by 2Fingers »

Mondi wrote:Look, I think this team could finish 30th, but even then would VERY VERY VERY likely draft 3rd.

That being said, a team with these pieces going forward is in decent shape:

______ Patrick Boeser
______ Horvat Eriksson
______ Sutter Hansen
_______ Gaunce Virtanen

Hutton Gudranson
Tanev Stetcher
Tryamkin Juolevi

I personally think Bartchee and Granlund are plugs, but you never know.
They are plugs, Hansen should be traded now while he is worth something.
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Re: The Rebuild...

Post by Chef Boi RD »

Reefer2 wrote:I have been saying for years that you don't stick with the same team year after year, when the Nucks went to the finals and they were missing a key piece called an asshole the following season they did nothing about it. Too many fans get used to names on the back of shirts vs. the logo on the front. Tough decisions have to be made and the GM needs the balls to do it.

Edler should of been traded a few years ago.
What are you talking about? Gillis' answer for Lucic - post Stanley cup run was a minor league troublesome player named - Zack Kassian. Brilliance
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