Ownership and Management

[Chef Boi RD]

I don’t do "that" anymore, not sure why everyone hasn’t noticed . Everyone must be scarred from the whole experience of it, like on pins and needles. Me? I’m tapped out and have moved on [mod edit].

Mod edit 2 - it has been noticed.

[Hockey Widow]

I think management has done a good job rebuilding/reshaping our defence.

I think they have given up too many draft picks

I think they have screwed the pooch on building a decent offence/top six

I give them no credit for having a good goalie in Demko and the jury is still out on the Lankinen vs Silovs debate. But It does appear they have drafted us depth in net for years to come.

I think they are masters at building a bottom 6.

I think they have done well to manage the cap but for sure have made some mistakes. I hated the OEL buyout but as time has gone on I see the wisdom of it.

[UWSaint]

I think management has done a good job rebuilding/reshaping our defence.

I think they have given up too many draft picks

I think they have screwed the pooch on building a decent offence/top six

I give them no credit for having a good goalie in Demko and the jury is still out on the Lankinen vs Silovs debate. But It does appear they have drafted us depth in net for years to come.

I think they are masters at building a bottom 6.

I think they have done well to manage the cap but for sure have made some mistakes. I hated the OEL buyout but as time has gone on I see the wisdom of it.

Their biggest error is how they publicly fumbled and undermined BB and the JT issue. I just got the impression in both of these situations -- and especially with the former -- that they were motivated to make "obviously necessary" moves that would have otherwise been unpopular. BB was a dead man walking at the start of 2022-23, and while there's no question he did himself no favors with that miserable start, he seemed set up to fail and the fact that they didn't make the move in the offseason when they knew they wanted to cost the Canucks what they might have otherwise enjoyed if they weren't playing in an environment that stunk of death.

I'm not sure there was a good way to handle JT/EP, but whatever they did wasn't geared towards maximizing trade value -- I mean it was at the beginning, but as time went on, they were so transparently desperate and they assisted EP40's own shortcomings to deflate his trade value (Miller's, too, though the return was okay all things considered).

From a player perspective, there have been hits and there have been misses -- as it always is. They are pretty decent at cutting their losses, and
they've ended up with a team of pretty good complements without a believable core (outside of Hughes and injury-risk Demko). This might be their greatest personnel skill -- finding decent complements. They were extremely active in Pittsburgh, and their efforts certainly made a difference to the last two cups, but of course there they were building those complements against something very solid. As boneheaded as the Lankinen extension was in my view (because they don't seem to get they have to play for upside because there is no point to mitigating the downside risk of a team otherwise mediocre), signing him the first time after outwaiting the market was brilliant -- as was outwaiting the market on Pius Suter the year before.

Early returns on drafting is not bad at all. If -- and it is a big if -- Sushi develops into an NHL talent, that first draft (2022) might end up being one of the Canucks better drafts in which they didn't have a top 10 pick. No 2d rounder, but it looks like they have a someday 4-5 maybe solid top 4 D in EP25. KK looks like the rare 7th rounder with a real shot at being an NHL player. The 4th rounder (Gardner) will be a bust, but Ty Young retains potential (even if the chance of success is low) and Dorrington (the 6th rounder) was good enough to be seen by the Rangers as an acceptable offset for the loss of Mancini from their system -- and the developing defensive prospect pipeline (incl. KK) made Dorrington redundant.

As for the next draft, Willander looks good so far -- definitely maintains his 2-3 upside, Brzyzyzyzyzwicz (traded with more for Lindholm) certainly is on a curve better than most 3rd rounders and was not a throw in for that trade (might have been necessary to move Kuzmenko's salary), the same can be said for Mynio, and Ty Mueller had a beyond-expectations rookie campaign in Abby last year (though has done nothing this year).

The pissed away their high picks in 2024 and you really need to have at least this season to judge what they got in later rounds (and two seasons for 2025), but 2025 first rounder Cootes showed himself ahead of the curve for a 15th overall in a (supposedly) weak draft.

Point is, there's a good deal to like and dislike about this management group. I'm a bit in the "against" category because (1) I think you could get personnel decision performance from people that don't undermine the workers (coaches, players) and (2) they are playing it conservatively when they need a home run. Honestly I would love to see RoboSwede without JR because I think JR is more responsible for the stuff I don't like, and your GM shouldn't appear cucked.

[Chef Boi RD]

I think management has done a good job rebuilding/reshaping our defence.

Hmmmm

With this wonderful defence in front of our wonderful goaltending tandem, with the back up making really good money, please explain Lankinens shitty start to the season? I mean, with such a good defence in front of him? His numbers suck for the his salary cap hit with this apparent “wonderful defence” in front of him.

I don’t think I have ever seen a shittier centre situation in the history of this organization. I mean when our 2C - Lukas “Goldobin” Reichel can’t even crack a line up (Blackhawks) on a team that apparently we are better than, what does that say about our centre depth? I mean, who the fuck trades gor a centre (Chytil) with a history of concussions? With a blue chip asset in JT Miller?

To be honest, I can’t tell who our 1C is right now? Pettersson? Reichel?

The JT Miller trade and the flip a first that came with it is a royal disaster and the Necas miss for Pettersson is a glorious opportunity missed, that to me is the killer, the “where it went sideways”. Could still have JT with Petey gone. How does Miller and Necas sound? Hmmm, nice right? I mean, Rutherford he supposed to be better than this, or so I’ve been led to believe?

Marcus Pettersson? Not impressed. I really could give two shits about O’Connor and Mancini, ffs. Bottom 6! Wow!! So amazing, you win those guys, not top 6. Who cares about the top 6.

Lankinen ‘big bucks back up’ numbers are shit, and with an apparently wonderfully built defence by yours truly - the great Jim Rutherford, in front of him.

[Carl Yagro]

^ I agree with much of this assessment... but with a lot less intensity

[Meds]

I think management has done a good job rebuilding/reshaping our defence.

I think they have given up too many draft picks

I think they have screwed the pooch on building a decent offence/top six

They have done a good job on the blueline, however they used the top-6 forwards group and picks to do it. Everything costs.

I think the top-6 would have been fine, even quite good, had Miller and Pettersson gotten along.....it would have meant no M.Pettersson in the top-4 though.

[Chef Boi RD]

^ I agree with much of this assessment... but with a lot less intensity

I’m getting frustrated, Carl. Probably a bit of an emotional response. But we hired an apparently experienced hockey man to avoid making the kind of mistakes that we are seeing from him and Allvin, mistakes that are starting to resemble the mistakes of the “previous guy”.

This whole rushing the process to being a winner that we have seen here since when the Aqualini’s took over has done sweet fuck all. It ain’t working - one step forward, two backwards, bloody tired of it. The long term outlook here looks like shit when you consider these western conference up and comers like we saw last night. Btw, that Rinzel kid is a helluva D-man. Chicago seems to be doing right with the draft.

[Chef Boi RD]

[Chef Boi RD]

.....it would have meant no M.Pettersson in the top-4 though.

Who cares, he’s overrated in my books and turns 30 in May. What good has he done? We have the 6th worst record in the NHL, ffs. Lol. He certainly ain’t helping Lankinens shitshow start.

[Meds]

As this thread also discusses ownership (by virtue of title) I have a thought.....

I'll ask you to bear with me as this thought does bring form management teams into the discussion, but not intended in a way to score one versus the other.

Going back a ways.....

Dave Nonis. Burke's assistant GM and ultimately his successor, carried that on. He had a plan I think, and he took lemons and made lemonade with the swap of Bertuzzi for Luongo. We all know why he was axed.

Mike Gillis. Took an existing roster and augmented it. He gets no credit for the goaltending, but he does get credit for the blueline and the rounding out of a deep forward group and making Vancouver a desirable destination for players. He spent draft capital like it was going out of style, and then when things were clearly going south he refused to change course and walked the plank. Despite what people say, I don't think Gillis was a moron who couldn't read the tea leaves. I think he wanted to change direction after 2012's one and done to the Kings but was told no, changed the coach, and when that cratered he was toast.

Linden/Benning. Mixed bag. Bad signings, some lost trades, never executing a rebuild but, like Burke, was acquiring parts for the next guy(s). The departure of Linden was telling here. One guy was ok being ownership's patsy to keep his job, the other guy said no and parted ways.

JR/PA. As Wids said, no credit for the goaltending, and frankly no credit for Hughes, Miller, Pettersson, Garland. The direction has been suspect, and frankly not what one would expect from guys with their experience and history (JR's in particular).

But there is a pattern.....it is with ownership. We sum it up with our "mushy middle", "good enough", comments. But it comes down to them replacing managers when the results don't come fast enough (even though their apparent direct meddling is half the reason for the failures).

[Meds]

.....it would have meant no M.Pettersson in the top-4 though.

Who cares, he’s overrated in my books and turns 30 in May. What good has he done? We have the 6th worst record in the NHL, ffs. Lol. He certainly ain’t helping Lankinens shitshow start.

I don't disagree with you on Metey.

I think the team was better in 2023 with JT Alpha Dog and a producing Petey. The blueline was missing a piece though, it did not necessarily have to be Pettersson, and I'm not wild about what I've seen this year from him.

Also agree on Lankinen, he is not living up to the contract.

[Carl Yagro]

I definitely get your frustration, Dude.

It looked like this group was finally putting it together and making positive steps towards some kind of contention window. Core was in its prime, with one of the best defencemen/play-drivers in the league, good center depth, good overall team depth, and most importantly, had 6 actual NHL defencemen (unfortunately, that didn't last long).

We've been begging for the D to be fixed and you saw some exciting results, unexpectedly leading to somehow one of the best seasons in franchise history.

I wished the drama had been resolved differently, sure. There were hard choices to be made, but it had to be made. In hindsight, I feel wrong choices were made. Who knows if those Buffalo rumours were even a thing? Who knows if the Necas thing was even close?

Yeah, hard to say, but here we are.

A quick, (more than) 2 steps backwards implosion.

The truth is, the rotting infrastructure was never completely dismantled so you can never rebuild/renovate properly. Like the left/Right, Republican/Democrat, this regime vs that regime nonsense people argue incessantly about... you need to look up and see who actually pulls the strings.

EDIT: Exactly, Mëds. Always was.

Now, I keep thinking how you going to entice the best player in history to re-sign his prime away when nobody here knows how to even get onto the on-ramp to the promised land.

I feel another hiatus coming...

[Chef Boi RD]

Quinn’s play this season looks very unenthusiastic. Why?

[Chef Boi RD]

It’s the owners. Nothing seems to change per management group. Same old same old. I imagine we will be buyers this trade deadline as a desparation move to keep Quinn enthusiastic about staying here in which in the end after all is said and done it will be another wrong approach taken.

[UWSaint]

Quinn’s play this season looks very unenthusiastic. Why?

Quinn Hughes almost never looks enthusiastic. He has always had a deadpan expression, and he was playing absolutely great for two periods last night before appearing to fatigue a bit in the third. No surprise coming off injury, especially a LBI.