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Strangelove wrote:Speaking of immigration... and world poverty... and gumballs:

Gum ball seems a good description of him.

Man is Trump an idiot, ok today he hasn't done anything stupid yet but there is 30 more minute in his time zone.

Entry into a foreign country is not a right.

It is a privileged.

You're right Doc, I've been laughing for days at extents opponents of the EO are going to make this a racist or bigoted action. Immigrants from seven countries, seven countries documented by the Obama administration as harbours of terrorists (note the previous administration would not use the words "Muslim Extremist") will face tighter scrutiny and in some cases, be denied access to the United States while the Immigration Department examines existing security protocols and makes any necessary charges to those protocols.

Citizens of some countries have free access, others require visa, other are not permitted. I have lived in countries where citizens being denied a visa to the US and Canada by US and Canadian officials is routine.

Last Fall the former head of the Immigration Department of Belize flew to the US and was denied access and had her US visa stripped from her passport before being put on a return flight. She's as black as the ace of spades and Obama was President at the time.

Stop whining.

Reefer2 wrote: today he hasn't done anything stupid yet but there is 30 more minute in his time zone.

Once again, Mr President has acted very shrewdly, nominating Judge Neil Gorsuch for the vacant Supreme Court position.

Topper wrote: Stop whining.

Yup, there was no uproar when Obama blocked Iraqi refugees for 6 months.

No whining when Obama shut the door on those Cubans...

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/22/worl ... .html?_r=3

More than 1,000 Cuban migrants who endured monthslong treks across as many as 10 countries to reach the United States are marooned in Mexico, halted by the Obama administration’s decision this month to end special immigration privileges for Cubans who make it to the American border.

So why the uproar now?

I'll tell you why: Half of America is owned + operated by the MSM.





Land of the not-so-free, home of the not-so-brave.

But hopefully The Donald will succeed in eventually making them great again...

Strangelove wrote: ... mainstream media and your liberals everywhere

When you include Cheney, McCain, Graham, the pope, Merkel and May in "liberals", you've gone so far right you've almost come full circle.

Strangelove wrote:

Per wrote: If you have been following the news these last few days, you must also have noticed how Trump and his cabal have back paddled. At first they revoked all visas for all people from these seven countries. They included green card holders, legal US residents and people holding dual citizenships, heck even people not being citizens of the aforementioned nations, but just being born there.

It's a standing Executive Order, hasn't changed and is readily available for reading, I linked it earlier.

Per wrote: it is no longer illegal.

Never was.

OK, let's take a look at it shall we:

... I hereby proclaim that the
immigrant and nonimmigrant entry into the United States of
aliens from countries referred to in section 217(a)(12) of
the INA, 8 U.S.C. 1187(a)(12), would be detrimental to the
interests of the United States, and I hereby suspend entry
into the United States, as immigrants and nonimmigrants, of
such persons for 90 days from the date of this order
(excluding those foreign nationals traveling on diplomatic
visas, North Atlantic Treaty Organization visas, C-2 visas
for travel to the United Nations, and G-1, G-2, G-3, and G-
4 visas).

OK, so the only exceptions mentioned are diplomatic visas, NATO visas, UN visas and G-1:4 visas, which are visas for foreign government representatives. Nothing about green cards, legal residents or people with dual citizenships.
Granted, it later in the text says that the Secretary of State (vacant post atm) and Secretary of Homeland Security may grant exceptions on a case by case basis; not specifically for these groups, but at least these two Secretaries have the right to grant exceptions. But notice, it doesn't give the immigration officers this right; these decisions go right to the top. To the Secretary of State and the Secretary of Homeland Security. And it says case by case. Not a blanket exclusion for all green card holders, legal residents and people with dual citizenships.

The conclusion must be, and this is exactly how it was received, that it does not grant exception to these groups.
Fortunately, members on the Trump administration have since back paddled, due to the strong criticism from eg the State Department and foreign leaders, and stated that the EO should not affect these groups, but that is not how it was phrased in this poorly worded EO.

Strangelove wrote:

Per wrote: And the reason it's referred to as a Muslim ban, is because during the campaign Trump spoke repeatedly about that he would ban Muslims from entering the USA.

Again, 90% of Muslims worldwide are still allowed in = not a "Muslim ban".
Again, "Muslim ban" is a phrase designed by the MSM to make Lord Trump appear to be a bigot.

Per wrote:No, a Muslim ban is something Trump proposed during his campaign and according to Giuliani what he still called it when asking for advice on how to frame it in a legal manner.
Giuliani on Fox.
Let's see you blame this on the liberal media.

Again, 90% of ... yada yada yada ....
In context Giuliani was actually talking about... something like... a "Muslim Extremist Ban"??
Can't really blame the guy for using a super-popular media catchphrase (form of brainwashing).

Watch the video again.

Giuliani says, quite clearly, that Trump wanted a Muslim Ban, in Trump's own words, and needed help how you could phrase that to make it legal. This is not something media came up with, it's a Trump catch phrase, just like Crooked Hillary, Build the Wall or Lying Ted. He came up with it, and he still used it when talking to Giuliani.

Watch the video.

Giuliani is not talking about a Muslim Extremist Ban, he is telling us that Donald wanted a Muslim Ban.
Maybe you should have your ears checked?

I worry about you, old chap.

Strangelove wrote:Speaking of immigration... and world poverty... and gumballs:

Three billion people in extreme poverty?!

This guy must be using statistics from the 1970's....

OK, let's stick with extreme simplification, but more recent figures:


That first guy was right though in that migration won't help solving world poverty.
It's free trade that offers the poor a chance to improve their lot, and thanks to globalisation we've seen a major shift in the right direction over the last few decades.

So give yourself a pat on the shoulder; thanks to all the crappy junk you bought from China (and sweat shops throughout SE Asia) the number of people living in extreme poverty has dropped from 3 billion to roughly 1 billion at the same time as the global population grew from 6 to 7 billion. We've gone from 50% in extreme povertry to 15% in our life time! It is an astonishing achievement, and it is only in part through aid; the main reason for this immense shift is the globalisation of free trade. It truly warms the heart of a dyed-in-the-wool free market liberal.

Strangelove wrote:
So why the uproar now?

I'll tell you why: Half of America is owned + operated by the MSM.

owned and operated by the Main Stream Media...

totally agree with you

but remember you said this because propaganda cuts both ways

Strangelove wrote:Speaking of immigration... and world poverty... and gumballs:

I saw this the other day from someone else defending Trump...


but all it does is give more weight to the argument that wealthy countries should be doing more than just allowing immigration they should be spreading the wealth

In fact, it highlights the vast gulf between the rich and the poor and is a condemnation of our global economic system.

Placeholder Yates and her political decision...........off with her head.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/02 ... nixon.html

ukcanuck wrote:

Strangelove wrote:Speaking of immigration... and world poverty... and gumballs:

I saw this the other day from someone else defending Trump...


but all it does is give more weight to the argument that wealthy countries should be doing more than just allowing immigration they should be spreading the wealth

In fact, it highlights the vast gulf between the rich and the poor and is a condemnation of our global economic system.

Except that his description of the world harks from the 1970's. The number of extremely poor has dropped dramatically over the past 40 years. See the video with Hans Rosling thst I posted in response.

Strangelove wrote: No whining when Obama shut the door on those Cubans...

So why the uproar now?

Most of those Cubans are fleeing for economic reasons, wishing for a better life. Completely understandable, but why should they have preferential treatment over Syrians that fear getting their throat slit by ISIS warriors?

Also, most of the uproar was about legal residents of the US, who were not allowed to return home after having been abroad. The Supreme Leader and his cabal back paddled on that specific part of the ban though, and now they are no longer stopping US residents or green card holders from entering.

Strangelove wrote:I'll tell you why: Half of America is owned + operated by the MSM.

Or phrased differently, half of America neither reads newspapers nor watches the news on TV.
Instead they trust desinformation sites like Breitbart or Infowars.....

Have not been on this thread for months. As I read today it occurs to me nothing has changed. All the usual suspects taking the same position. I heard Bill Nye say the other day that all the conflict going on over Trump is happening in two separate bubbles with neither side hearing the other. I think he is right.

I will acknowledge one thing I admire Trump for doing and that is doing what he said he would do. The events since he took office should not surprise anyone. The only real surprise is he followed through, for better or worse. Time will tell. He was legally elected so the best approach for me is to stay out of the two bubbles and see what happens. This i not a time for passionate intensity in support of or against the subject. It is a time to keep an open mind and wait for events to play out.

damonberryman wrote: I heard Bill Nye say the other day that all the conflict going on over Trump is happening in two separate bubbles

Doesn't this Bubble talk belong on the hockey Forum?

Speaking of FOX NEWS (elbows Topper and Doc) have they retracted their report that Bissonette is a Moroccan Muslim ?


Cause people could get the wrong impression,

you know, the people what watch that "news" station?

.

I’m sick as a dog but from where I sit…

Per is alternating between shitting on the carpet and chasing his tail.

Mondi is alternating between sniffing Damon’s butt and humping his leg.

UK is busy licking his own nether region in the corner.

*takes another swig of cough medicine*

Came here to find out if they locked up that bitch yet, oh well, back to bed…

But first:



Peace on Earth, purity of essence, goodwill to dawgs...