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Rats what does it say when a life long military man such as president Eisenhower tried to warn the American people of the Military Industrial Complex when he left office in 1961. It ain’t working anymore like he warned it eventually wouldn’t
It says you gotta watch it.... which I agree with. It doesn’t mean stop it and lower your defence standards it means figure it out while maintaining safetyChef Boi RD wrote: ↑Sun May 03, 2020 12:33 pmRats what does it say when a life long military man such as president Eisenhower tried to warn the American people of the Military Industrial Complex when he left office in 1961
But they are not watching it. It’s out of control, it’s going to collapse eventually if they don’t get a hold on it, make changes. Two choices completely bankrupt the nation or roll back the military industrial complex, it doesn’t work anymorerats19 wrote: ↑Sun May 03, 2020 12:36 pmIt says you gotta watch it.... which I agree with. It doesn’t mean stop it and lower your defence standards it means figure it out while maintaining safetyChef Boi RD wrote: ↑Sun May 03, 2020 12:33 pmRats what does it say when a life long military man such as president Eisenhower tried to warn the American people of the Military Industrial Complex when he left office in 1961
Build the economy find less expensive ways of maintainingChef Boi RD wrote: ↑Sun May 03, 2020 12:42 pmBut they are not watching it. It’s out of control, it’s going to collapse eventually if they don’t get a hold on it, make changes. Two choices completely bankrupt the nation or roll back the military industrial complex, it doesn’t work anymorerats19 wrote: ↑Sun May 03, 2020 12:36 pmIt says you gotta watch it.... which I agree with. It doesn’t mean stop it and lower your defence standards it means figure it out while maintaining safetyChef Boi RD wrote: ↑Sun May 03, 2020 12:33 pmRats what does it say when a life long military man such as president Eisenhower tried to warn the American people of the Military Industrial Complex when he left office in 1961
But it’s not working, Doc. Or at least they can’t continue this way. China is America’s biggest lender, they’ve been warning the US for years to get their financial house in order, the only reason China is lax for now is because of trade between the two countries which is why Trump keeps bringing trade up to remind them to stay off their backs. But China will eventually stop investing in US Treasuries the further the US becomes incapable of paying back their debt. In other words the US is fuckedStrangelove wrote: ↑Sun May 03, 2020 12:54 pm Yeah, come on Dude, people have been saying "it doesn’t work anymore" for decades...
Dude; What did President John F. Kennedy "almost have to do a very short time after Eisenhower's speech?Chef Boi RD wrote: ↑Sun May 03, 2020 12:33 pmRats what does it say when a life long military man such as president Eisenhower tried to warn the American people of the Military Industrial Complex when he left office in 1961. It ain’t working anymore like he warned it eventually wouldn’t
Call Sands. LOL---they're only paying the interest anyways. That debt aint never getting paid back. They know this..Chef Boi RD wrote: ↑Sun May 03, 2020 1:07 pmBut it’s not working, Doc. Or at least they can’t continue this way. China is America’s biggest lender, they’ve been warning the US for years to get their financial house in order, the only reason China is lax for now is because of trade between the two countries which is why Trump keeps bringing trade up to remind them to stay off their backs. But China will eventually stop investing in US Treasuries the further the US becomes incapable of paying back their debt. In other words the US is fuckedStrangelove wrote: ↑Sun May 03, 2020 12:54 pm Yeah, come on Dude, people have been saying "it doesn’t work anymore" for decades...
I would say neither. I understand the reasoning behind the policies of Sweden’s Public Health Agency. They realize the virus has spread worldwide. There is no way it can be contained. Well, sure, a lockdown. But the minute you open things up it will be there. This is not about getting through a few weeks or a few months. This is about sticking it out for approximately two years or more.The Brown Wizard wrote: ↑Fri May 01, 2020 11:33 am https://nypost.com/2020/04/28/sweden-r ... ockdowns/
Yikes. These stats are from a few weeks ago even...Sweden has recorded more than 19,600 confirmed cases of COVID-19 as of Tuesday afternoon, resulting in 2,355 deaths, according to Johns Hopkins University. By comparison, Sweden’s Nordic neighbors — Denmark, Norway and Finland — have recorded just 434, 206 and 199 deaths, respectively, as of Tuesday afternoon.
Per, would you attribute the idiocy of the swedish policy more to arrogance or stupidity? I'm leaning towards arrogance
Stick to roofing, MickeyMicky wrote: ↑Sun May 03, 2020 1:16 pm
Dude; What did President John F. Kennedy "almost have to do a very short time after Eisenhower's speech?
During the last year of Jimmy Carter's term, why was the PTL club running TV segments of how far ahead the Soviet's were in terms of numbers
of nuclear missiles and capability of deploying them to US soil.
There has been many interviews from ex Soviet military generals that say "yes" we were planning a potential attack.
How do you feel about China and North Korea growing their warfare technology in an exponential manor?
I do not feel well at all without some degree of "Balance Of Power"
I'm glad I got neighbors that will fight for their life-style.
We are miles away from a utopian society. Miles. It's fine to wish it but you really wanna let your guard down to see if it works?
Not me.
Herd immunity as a solution is still being debated Per. Also, fiddling numbers/cherry picking statistics to justify the absurdly high death rate is a rediculous defense.Per wrote: ↑Sun May 03, 2020 1:28 pmI would say neither. I understand the reasoning behind the policies of Sweden’s Public Health Agency. They realize the virus has spread worldwide. There is no way it can be contained. Well, sure, a lockdown. But the minute you open things up it will be there. This is not about getting through a few weeks or a few months. This is about sticking it out for approximately two years or more.The Brown Wizard wrote: ↑Fri May 01, 2020 11:33 am https://nypost.com/2020/04/28/sweden-r ... ockdowns/
Yikes. These stats are from a few weeks ago even...Sweden has recorded more than 19,600 confirmed cases of COVID-19 as of Tuesday afternoon, resulting in 2,355 deaths, according to Johns Hopkins University. By comparison, Sweden’s Nordic neighbors — Denmark, Norway and Finland — have recorded just 434, 206 and 199 deaths, respectively, as of Tuesday afternoon.
Per, would you attribute the idiocy of the swedish policy more to arrogance or stupidity? I'm leaning towards arrogance
Thus they have not wanted to implement rules that cannot be in place for more than a few months, as it will not serve any real purpose, but will cripple the economy, causing bankrupcies and unemployment, which in turn will lead to health problems. Unemployment increases the risk of depression, suicide, alcoholism, obesity, high blood pressure and even some types of cancer. It has been calculated that every percentage point of increased unemployment in the USA leads to 40,000 premature deaths.
The Swedish strategy has been to flatten the curve without enforcing rules that cannot be in place for a long time.
The virus will continue to pose a threat until we achieve herd immunity, which can either happen through a majority of the population having had the disease and developed antibodies or through developing a vaccine.
A properly vetted and tested vaccine could not really be available faster than in eighteen months. If they launch something sooner they must have cut corners, which immediately raises concerns over effectiveness and safety.
So either, we keep all of society in lockdown for at least two years (18 months to develop and test the vaccine, at least 6 months to massproduce, distribute and vaccinate, or we try to let the virus spread through the healthy population at a rate that is not too fast for the hospitals to be able to cope with, while attempting to isolate and protect the risk groups.
A Harvard study that I linked to earlier suggested that ideally the spread of the virus should be slowed down between 20 and 40% to flatten the curve sufficiently to not overload healthcare capacity, but if you slow it more than 60%, the second peak will get worse than the first one, so you have not solved the problem, just postponed it.
A lockdown that lasts less than two years will basically just push the peak (and also the achieving of herd immunity) a little bit further down the road while devastating the economy.
The Finnish state epidemiologist, Salminen, just last week expressed concern that Finland may have gone into lockdown too early, as they have hardly any cases outside of Helsinki, and that they may have to ease up on restrictions.
Comparing covid stats between Sweden and the other Nordic countries at this point serves no purpose. We are at completely different stages. This is a marathon, and we have barely left the starting line. The only resulrs that matter are the ones at the end of the race, roughly two years down the line.
At present it is estimated that some 25% of people in Stockholm have had the disease, and at no point has the hospitals been overwhelmed. There is still roughly 30% spare capacity in intensive care. Oh, but that is only because over two months Sweden managed to more than double the amount of ICU spots available. In part through converting operating rooms to ICUs and taking in retired staff as well as having OR and anaesthesia nurses switch to intensive care. This has of course meant that most elective surgery has been cancelled or postponed, which of course is a problem we will need to address down the road.
In Finland perhaps 2-3% have had covid-19. We will be back in business long before they reach their peak. And sure, if they can stick it out for two years, till there is a vaccine, maybe they have saved a few lives, but will anyone still have a job? And will society still function with all companies bankrupt and no taxes flowing into the public coffers?
Also, a lot of people point to the high death tolls in Belgium or even Sweden without realizing that these two countries count all deaths of people with corona symptoms, whether tested or not, whereas most countries only count deaths in hospitals with confirmed covid-19. The latter approach leads ro a huge gap between reported corona deaths and excess deaths compared to previous years. Eg the US is estimated by the Financial Times to have 60% more corona deaths than they report. Thus comparing these artificially low numbers with those that report all excess deaths is really a case of apples and oranges.
The relevant numbers imho are excess deaths compared to historical data, and there is also no use comparing numbers now. Get back in two years time, and we can see which strategy was more successful.
Per voraciously defends everything Sweden does.The Brown Wizard wrote: ↑Sun May 03, 2020 4:13 pm i find it bizarre that you are so voraciously defending this.
Well forking over government cash to stay home for the benefit of society is about as left wing as it gets...you would think Per would see this.Strangelove wrote: ↑Sun May 03, 2020 4:19 pmPer voraciously defends everything Sweden does.The Brown Wizard wrote: ↑Sun May 03, 2020 4:13 pm i find it bizarre that you are so voraciously defending this.
He's trying to convince everyone the left way is the right way.
Sorry to hear about your wife's grampa...
