Ownership and Management

[rikster]

Hughes dictates the situation, we are only entertaining the idea of trading him if he chooses to go to market. We are not trading him because we want to rebuild, let’s be clear about that. He’s the best defenceman this organization has ever had. He’s our best player, and top 5 best player in the game, of course we all want to keep him.

Our struggle is, if this team continues to shit the bed, does this give Hughes pause on whether he wants to stay here? I’m 50/50 with regards to what Quinn wants. One half tells me he likes it here, likes the organization and would like to stay, the other half says no, he wants out but is too classy and a pro to give any indication of that.

Enjoying Blobs original post and the discussion that has followed...

Trading Hughes could be our version of the Hershal Walker trade and get us closer to the Cup than a rebuild or resigning him will....

Not to mention Quinn is starting to follow his brother Jacks inability to stay healthy which brings into question his ability to survive 4 rounds in the Spring...

[Blob Mckenzie]

I said after Lidstrom and Datsyuk faded out. Holland had a good run yes, was the architect of the golden age of the Yzerman/Lidstrom/Datsuk Wings but he has been a bum since Lidstrom and Datsyuk aged out.

Once a great GM doesn’t mean always a great GM. Because Rutherford has done some good things in the past doesn’t mean he isn’t capable of shitting the bed which is clearly what he has done here. Not sure how you can give him the thumbs up on a job well done here, it’s been far from it.

20 straight years in the playoffs. 4 cups and countless top 4 finishes in the plaoffs. But he's a bum because Lidstrom finally got old.

Nam me a better NHL executive, hell a better sports executive over the last 40 years.

[Chef Boi RD]

I said after Lidstrom and Datsyuk faded out. Holland had a good run yes, was the architect of the golden age of the Yzerman/Lidstrom/Datsuk Wings but he has been a bum since Lidstrom and Datsyuk aged out.

Once a great GM doesn’t mean always a great GM. Because Rutherford has done some good things in the past doesn’t mean he isn’t capable of shitting the bed which is clearly what he has done here. Not sure how you can give him the thumbs up on a job well done here, it’s been far from it.

20 straight years in the playoffs. 4 cups and countless top 4 finishes in the plaoffs. But he's a bum because Lidstrom finally got old.

Nam me a better NHL executive, hell a better sports executive over the last 40 years.

I recognize the great that Holland has done, of course, I’m speaking more along the lines of “what have you done for me lately” as the saying goes, in that, I couldn’t give two shits about ones past exploits, if I did, I’d suggest we go all in on Steven Stamkos or Jonathon Toews or seek Patrice Bergeron to come out of retirement to fix our problem’ed centre position, a mess made by the “great” Jimmy Rutherford. I find that too many folk excuse the putrid mistakes made by some powers that be all because they possess a resume that will knock your socks off.

[Cousin Strawberry]

Yet you think he drafted Zetterburg and Datsyuk by fluke makes a man want to puke.

Ummm they were total flukes Blob

They picked 6 scrubs before PD in 98 and 4 before HZ in 99

Holland was a draft day fuck up since the dawn of time

[rikster]

I said after Lidstrom and Datsyuk faded out. Holland had a good run yes, was the architect of the golden age of the Yzerman/Lidstrom/Datsuk Wings but he has been a bum since Lidstrom and Datsyuk aged out.

Once a great GM doesn’t mean always a great GM. Because Rutherford has done some good things in the past doesn’t mean he isn’t capable of shitting the bed which is clearly what he has done here. Not sure how you can give him the thumbs up on a job well done here, it’s been far from it.

20 straight years in the playoffs. 4 cups and countless top 4 finishes in the plaoffs. But he's a bum because Lidstrom finally got old.

Nam me a better NHL executive, hell a better sports executive over the last 40 years.

Since this is a Ownership and Managment thread it is worth noting that much of Hollands best work was done pre salary cap with an owner who allowed him a payroll well above other teams..

Remember the 1997 season and Federov being paid $28 million which included his signing bonuses and playoff bonuses?

[Lancer]

Speaking of the pre-cap and post-cap periods, I giggle at the idea of management making 'hockey trades' for the likes of Sherwood, Garland, et al.

'Hockey trades' have gone the way of the do-do bird ever since the cap came into effect. Besides the cap factor affecting trade pieces, the hockey ecosystem has created consensus wisdom that argues against 'hockey trades'.

If you want someone like a Garland or Sherwood, are you going to part with a sub-25 year old top-6 centre to get them? With ELC contracts being hoarded like dragon gold for cap economy, good luck with that? Who's going to trade a good young centre on a cheap contract for a veteran winger or two? If Allvin and Rutherford find a GM willing to do so, unless the kid in question is looking at a deal they won't be able to fit under the cap, then you have to wonder what red flags exist on the kid to warrant management parting with a young asset.

If management isn't interested in picks in return for vets (and I would agree), then the kind of players coming back are likely more along your Reichels and Lamberts - players whose drafting clubs have run out of patience with them and want to get something before putting them on waivers. Otherwise, you start hunting for impending RFAs who may price themselves out of their club's cap. Even then, any RFAs who would move the needle are on clubs with tons of cap space. Anaheim has a lot of RFAs to deal with this summer but they also have over $17 million in cap space.

Let's see if Allvin and Rutherford pull anything other than draft picks and failed 1st-rounders out of their hat.

[Chef Boi RD]

Good post, Lancer. I agree with everything you said, the “hockey trade” is another way of saying “lame as fuck return”. And you’re right, nobody in their right mind is parting with a top prospect or a good “young centre” to get your Garlands or Sherwoods, but this seems be how this management group rolls, a long line of meh returns that keep making this organization worse by each transaction. Downward and bottomward we go.

[Lancer]

Bublé defending management:

“No one in management can be blamed for what happened with JT [Miller]. Or the brutal amount of injuries and bad luck. They’ve drafted pretty well and if Quinn Doesn’t want to resign, that’s not their fault either. They’re dealt the hand and they play it. I like the management team and while I hate losing like this, I see a lot of light at the end of this tunnel. Great young D core. Up and coming goalies. And some very good players who wanna be here. Might be a shit year but I think we’re gonna be ok. Jim [Rutherford] has won at every level. Calder, Memorial, Stanley Cups. Guy knows how to win. Let Toronto and Oiler fans panic. I think very soon, we’ll be the team to beat. And then the world can hate us again as the cocky asshole fans we were meant to be.”

His argument is charmingly emotional and he's not wrong about Oilers and leaves fans panicking - they have had how many years with their generational stars and have what to show for it??

Still, though, the optimism isn't landing with me, at least. Save it for next September.

BTW, who in that room wants to be here????? Are we sure they aren't just grateful for an NHL paycheque anywhere and would be just as happy in Columbus? Are they anyone we as fans give a shit about, or are they BC guys who are just happy to play in their home province like Myers and Kane, or are they players who are set for life and know that no other club would pay them as much - such as Boeser and Petey?

Would be nice if Captain Quinn would give a convincing defence of the organization, the room or the city to change the developing narrative of the Canucks being a ship with any player worth anything quietly hitting the lifeboats however they can. While Quinn has come forward previously with his affection for Vancouver and appreciation for the club drafting him, I have only found his commitment to the city and organization nominal at best. He does what he does, it seems, because it's expected of him as captain and he's a diligent soul. No matter his familial connections, he's an American, and what American has ever fully-invested themselves in a Canadian club? Brady may be too brain-damaged to qualify even if he's the Senators' captain. I'm not holding my breath expecting Quinn to be so invested in this club and city that he would give the team a vote of confidence this season.

"Great young D core"?? Outside of Quinn the only 'young D core' are Willander and D. Petey and they aren't knocking anyone's socks off.

"Up and Coming goalies"?? You mean the ones who've been ventilated in Vancouver and Abby?? Medvedev is the only goalie in the system who offers promise of being a starter, and he's years away.

Sorry Mike, if Hughes leaves, you may as well tear it down to the studs. We've seen the on-ice product without Quinn on the ice, and it will be just as tough to watch this bunch three years from now (at earliest) when the darling top-5 pick takes to the Vancouver ice, as it has been this season.

[Chef Boi RD]

Personally I think the Jim Rutherford and Allvin duo has done a worse job managing a professional sports team in Vancouver than Stu Jackson.

At least Benning for all his fuckups left a foundation of all stars

[Cornuck]

BTW, who in that room wants to be here????? Are we sure they aren't just grateful for an NHL paycheque anywhere and would be just as happy in Columbus? Are they anyone we as fans give a shit about, or are they BC guys who are just happy to play in their home province like Myers and Kane, or are they players who are set for life and know that no other club would pay them as much - such as Boeser and Petey?

We'll never know for sure, but I'm assuming that Vancouver might be one of the nicer cities to play in. I got the impression the Boeser wanted to stay here, but again - who knows.

The flip side is having management seemingly shopping players year-round, like they apparently are now with "vets are available for purchase - easy financing". At some point, as a player that has to wear thin.

[Meds]

BTW, who in that room wants to be here????? Are we sure they aren't just grateful for an NHL paycheque anywhere and would be just as happy in Columbus? Are they anyone we as fans give a shit about, or are they BC guys who are just happy to play in their home province like Myers and Kane, or are they players who are set for life and know that no other club would pay them as much - such as Boeser and Petey?

We'll never know for sure, but I'm assuming that Vancouver might be one of the nicer cities to play in. I got the impression the Boeser wanted to stay here, but again - who knows.

The flip side is having management seemingly shopping players year-round, like they apparently are now with "vets are available for purchase - easy financing". At some point, as a player that has to wear thin.

I think it depends upon the player.

Younger guys might prefer the scene in Anaheim/LA, New York, Florida/Tampa, Vegas.

If you're simply talking about what the city looks like, locale, etc.....then yeah, Vancouver would be in the top 5 or so I would think.

Vancouver is certainly a far more attractive city than any of the other NHL destinations in Canada.

I haven't visited them all, but the only NHL cities that compete, imho, are the Florida teams.

[Chef Boi RD]

I think players prefer the anonymity they get playing in cities outside of Canada these days.

[Meds]

I think players prefer the anonymity they get playing in cities outside of Canada these days.

I agree with that. I'd say that Vancouver is probably in the bottom-10 of the league when it comes to local media. I'm shocked Boeser stuck around.

[Carl Yagro]

The flip side is having management seemingly shopping players year-round, like they apparently are now with "vets are available for purchase - easy financing". At some point, as a player that has to wear thin.

This is a good point.

Don't know what he was like before, but ever since he arrived here, JR has had an itchy bum that he can't stop scratching.

Which long-ish contracts (more than 2 years), signed in good faith by the players, lasted past the 3rd year before that player was gonzo? Where's the loyalty expected from players but not the organization?

I guess the players and their agents didn't realize they signed a lease agreement and JR loves driving the newest models.

[Lancer]

BTW, who in that room wants to be here????? Are we sure they aren't just grateful for an NHL paycheque anywhere and would be just as happy in Columbus? Are they anyone we as fans give a shit about, or are they BC guys who are just happy to play in their home province like Myers and Kane, or are they players who are set for life and know that no other club would pay them as much - such as Boeser and Petey?

We'll never know for sure, but I'm assuming that Vancouver might be one of the nicer cities to play in. I got the impression the Boeser wanted to stay here, but again - who knows.

The flip side is having management seemingly shopping players year-round, like they apparently are now with "vets are available for purchase - easy financing". At some point, as a player that has to wear thin.

I think it depends upon the player.

Younger guys might prefer the scene in Anaheim/LA, New York, Florida/Tampa, Vegas.

If you're simply talking about what the city looks like, locale, etc.....then yeah, Vancouver would be in the top 5 or so I would think.

Vancouver is certainly a far more attractive city than any of the other NHL destinations in Canada.

I haven't visited them all, but the only NHL cities that compete, imho, are the Florida teams.

IMHO, taxes and stuff all being equal, Vancouver would be a top place to live and play as an NHLer.

I'm Canadian.

Pretty sure European players appreciate the city and its fans - and not just the Sedins either.

But it is to wonder what Americans think of the place - and this is where taxes and the other stuff come into play. For all the American players who either have fond experiences playing in the CHL there are the MAGA or MAGA-affiliated bunch (eg. Gaudette) who see anywhere north as a commie wasteland. Whether the last name is Tkachuk, Gaudette or Gaudreau (or Miller, really) there are enough examples of American players who would rather play anywhere than in Canada.

Like I said, there are a lot of American role players and lesser lights who are undoubtedly happy to be in Vancouver just because it means an NHL paycheque - even if they're not playing in 'Murrica'. You can find those guys to fill gaps without too much worry as long as you pay them well enough.

If Hughes does the American thing, though, hopefully management thinks twice before drafting an American in any but the 5th round or later. They won't be drafting them - they'll be developing them for an American team before too long.