US Erection 12 *AND* 16 *AND* 20 *AND* 22 *AND* 24 *AND* Beyond

[5thhorseman]

A lot of this bond talk has ben massively over-simplified. It has also completey ignored the fact that the same countries that hold US debt also owe the US a portion of their debt. This guy has only looked at 1 side of the issue.

The US holds a negligible amount of China's debt. So it is one-sided. China has Trump by the balls.

[Tciso]

Still oversimplified. Also, the Financial Post's own words confuse the issue. "U.S. Treasuries are the global lending market benchmark, used by banks around the world" That sounds like market manipulation, and the result isn't necessarily a win for the other countries.

And, it does make it cheaper for the USA to buy their own debt back. Like I said. Oversimplified. It's written as if it was a silver bullet, except Trump is a vampire, not a werewolf.

[Tciso]

A lot of this bond talk has ben massively over-simplified. It has also completey ignored the fact that the same countries that hold US debt also owe the US a portion of their debt. This guy has only looked at 1 side of the issue.

The US holds a negligible amount of China's debt. So it is one-sided. China has Trump by the balls.

Speaking of debt, they just bought Carney's balls too.

[Cousin Strawberry]

A lot of this bond talk has ben massively over-simplified. It has also completey ignored the fact that the same countries that hold US debt also owe the US a portion of their debt. This guy has only looked at 1 side of the issue.

The US holds a negligible amount of China's debt. So it is one-sided. China has Trump by the balls.

Speaking of debt, they just bought Carney's balls too.

They're all dirty filthy little sausages

[Per]

The SCOTUS ruling that you cannot prosecute for acts that someone has done as part of the office of the presidency is troublesome and goes against the core belief the US founding fathers had that there should be no king in America.

Take for instance the case of Kilmar Armando Abrego Garcia.
The Trump administration has conceded that he got sent to the concentration camp in El Salvador by mistake. He shouldn't be there. But despite the Supreme Court ruling that they must do what they can to bring him home, Trump just shrugs and says "nothing I can do", which of course is a lie.

This would normally be considered contempt of court, which is a rather serious crime, but since Trump is doing all this as acting president, there is nothing the courts can do, as they already tied their own hands with the absurd ruling that a president cannot be prosecuted for acts he has performed in the role of president. I guess they could go after some of his minions, but that's not addressing the core problem.

I find it absurd. Noone should be above the law.

The checks and balances, and the separation of powers, that form American democracy, have been rendered impotent if the courts cannot enforce the laws.

Equality before the law and rule of law are central tenets of Western Democracy.
The notion that someone should be above the law goes against that.
By abandoning these principles the USA is now on a slippery slope toward authoritarian rule.

[5thhorseman]

Trump just shrugs and says "nothing I can do", which of course is a lie.

It would be a PR nightmare for Trump if Garcia were to be brought back to the US. It will be interesting to see what Xinis' next steps are but I don't hold out much hope of her being successful.

[5thhorseman]

Still oversimplified. Also, the Financial Post's own words confuse the issue. "U.S. Treasuries are the global lending market benchmark, used by banks around the world" That sounds like market manipulation, and the result isn't necessarily a win for the other countries.

And, it does make it cheaper for the USA to buy their own debt back. Like I said. Oversimplified. It's written as if it was a silver bullet, except Trump is a vampire, not a werewolf.

How does the FP's words confuse things? This only means that Treasury bill are considered the safest investment worldwide, backed by the "full faith and credit of the US", and other similar securities are priced relative to them. This isn't market manipulation, this is the market in action.

As for buying their own debt back, where would the money come from? They are running a deficit in the trillions. Not only are they having to issue new treasuries to pay for those that mature (rolling over existing debt) but also new treasuries to finance the deficit (this is why the debt ceiling keeps getting raised).

China and other countries also hold a lot of mortgage-backed securities (MBS). They could play havoc with the US housing market by dumping them.

[Tciso]

Still oversimplified. Also, the Financial Post's own words confuse the issue. "U.S. Treasuries are the global lending market benchmark, used by banks around the world" That sounds like market manipulation, and the result isn't necessarily a win for the other countries.

And, it does make it cheaper for the USA to buy their own debt back. Like I said. Oversimplified. It's written as if it was a silver bullet, except Trump is a vampire, not a werewolf.

How does the FP's words confuse things? This only means that Treasury bill are considered the safest investment worldwide, backed by the "full faith and credit of the US", and other similar securities are priced relative to them. This isn't market manipulation, this is the market in action.

As for buying their own debt back, where would the money come from? They are running a deficit in the trillions. Not only are they having to issue new treasuries to pay for those that mature (rolling over existing debt) but also new treasuries to finance the deficit (this is why the debt ceiling keeps getting raised).

China and other countries also hold a lot of mortgage-backed securities (MBS). They could play havoc with the US housing market by dumping them.

So, to follow the FP statement, other nations are selling us bonds, lowering their value, and increasing their yield.
That cause and effect is true. Then, they are destabilizing many of their own markets that use us bonds as the benchmark, causing domestic financial issues. How badly do they want to mess up their own economies is a question to ask.

As for buying back debt. Hmmm. Start by lowering your deficit. Print more money to buy it back. Sell gold at record highs to buy discounted debt. Sell "war bonds", or "Maga bonds" to Americans and use that to buy back debt.

There are options. I am not an economist, but it's easy to see that options exist.

[JelloPuddingPop]

Print more money to buy it back.

I am not an economist

All you need right there.

[Tciso]

Print more money to buy it back.

I am not an economist

All you need right there.

Niether was the author of the original article, but why not take the opinion of a self professed media guy, content provider, dog whisperer, Canadian raconteur and muckraker as irrefutable truth.

[rikster]

Start by lowering your deficit. Print more money to buy it back. Sell gold at record highs to buy discounted debt. Sell "war bonds", or "Maga bonds" to Americans and use that to buy back debt.

Unfortunately it's not that simple as DOGE and MAGA have found out...

Remember Musk promised a $2 Trillion dollar savings on the campaign trail, lowered it to $1Trillion after the election and has produced a fraction of that promised savings with some suggesting that when the costs to reduce the Federal workforce are factored in there will be little if any true savings...

Meanwhile the interest on their national debt has overtaken military spending as the highest cost to the Government so the last thing they need is higher interest rates....

Trump promised on the campaign trail to make permanent his temporary tax cuts from his first term...

Remember that when that bill was passed, Trump predicted that it would grow their GDP to as high as 8-10%...it needed a GDP of 5% to pay for itself...it delivered a GDP of under 3% which is contributed to a record deficit which led to record debt....

The Republicans are pushing for a new spending bill that will have as much as $4-5 Trillion in deficit spending ...

They are attempting to reduce that deficit spending with tariff revenues and cuts to social programs leading to headlines like this one....

https://www.politico.com/news/2025/04/1 ... p-00288914

Trump and his lackeys thought they were the smartest people in the room and have ignored the best and brightest and history who have been warning of the unintended consequences of this trade war and unfortunately for all of us the best and brightest have been proven to be right...

Meanwhile China just chugs along quietly fostering new trade relations and strengthening existing relations thru their Belt Road Initiative which started in 2013....

https://eng.yidaiyilu.gov.cn/

[5thhorseman]

So, to follow the FP statement, other nations are selling us bonds, lowering their value, and increasing their yield.
That cause and effect is true. Then, they are destabilizing many of their own markets that use us bonds as the benchmark, causing domestic financial issues. How badly do they want to mess up their own economies is a question to ask.

Yes, this is a good point. Perhaps they dumped bonds to remind Trump of their interdependencies, but it's not something that can be sustained.

As for buying back debt. Hmmm. Start by lowering your deficit. Print more money to buy it back. Sell gold at record highs to buy discounted debt. Sell "war bonds", or "Maga bonds" to Americans and use that to buy back debt.

There are options. I am not an economist, but it's easy to see that options exist.

The US owns less than $1T of gold, so selling all of it couldn't even finance one years' worth of deficit spending, let alone the debt itself.

Printing money will devalue the USD and will drive investors away from USD-denominated assets. I believe the administration's overall plan is to devalue the USD anyways, thereby making US exports more competitive, but I'm not sure how they will do this without impacting rate or, even more importantly, losing the position of USD as the world's reserve currency.

Selling "war/MAGA bonds" is just exchanging one type of debt for another. And if you're thinking that these bonds would only be available for sale in the US, there's not enough liquidity there to satisfy the US government's borrowing needs. They need to sell debt to large investors on the global market.

[Tciso]

So, to follow the FP statement, other nations are selling us bonds, lowering their value, and increasing their yield.
That cause and effect is true. Then, they are destabilizing many of their own markets that use us bonds as the benchmark, causing domestic financial issues. How badly do they want to mess up their own economies is a question to ask.

Yes, this is a good point. Perhaps they dumped bonds to remind Trump of their interdependencies, but it's not something that can be sustained.

As for buying back debt. Hmmm. Start by lowering your deficit. Print more money to buy it back. Sell gold at record highs to buy discounted debt. Sell "war bonds", or "Maga bonds" to Americans and use that to buy back debt.

There are options. I am not an economist, but it's easy to see that options exist.

The US owns less than $1T of gold, so selling all of it couldn't even finance one years' worth of deficit spending, let alone the debt itself.

Printing money will devalue the USD and will drive investors away from USD-denominated assets. I believe the administration's overall plan is to devalue the USD anyways, thereby making US exports more competitive, but I'm not sure how they will do this without impacting rate or, even more importantly, losing the position of USD as the world's reserve currency.

Selling "war/MAGA bonds" is just exchanging one type of debt for another. And if you're thinking that these bonds would only be available for sale in the US, there's not enough liquidity there to satisfy the US government's borrowing needs. They need to sell debt to large investors on the global market.

While I agree that none of them alone would be enough, my point that the USA has options to deal with it still stands. I didn't even mention doing a debt default with China yet <ka-fuckin-boom to the whole world>. I'll stop typing, in case JD Vance is following this thread

[Strangelove]

The SCOTUS ruling that you cannot prosecute for acts that someone has done as part of the office of the presidency is troublesome and goes against the core belief the US founding fathers had that there should be no king in America.

Take for instance the case of Kilmar Armando Abrego Garcia.
The Trump administration has conceded that he got sent to the concentration camp in El Salvador by mistake. He shouldn't be there. But despite the Supreme Court ruling that they must do what they can to bring him home, Trump just shrugs and says "nothing I can do", which of course is a lie.

This would normally be considered contempt of court, which is a rather serious crime, but since Trump is doing all this as acting president, there is nothing the courts can do, as they already tied their own hands with the absurd ruling that a president cannot be prosecuted for acts he has performed in the role of president. I guess they could go after some of his minions, but that's not addressing the core problem.

I find it absurd. Noone should be above the law.

The checks and balances, and the separation of powers, that form American democracy, have been rendered impotent if the courts cannot enforce the laws.

Equality before the law and rule of law are central tenets of Western Democracy.
The notion that someone should be above the law goes against that.
By abandoning these principles the USA is now on a slippery slope toward authoritarian rule.

SCOTUS merely said the Trump administration must "facilitate" the return of Garcia to America.

The Trump administration has facilitated by offering a plane should El Salvador decide to return him.

No "contempt of court" and no "lying" by Trump.

Garcia is an El Salvadoran citizen presently in El Salvador.

It is up to them what is done with him.

[Cornuck]

Good to see that your heart is the right place, Doc. Tis a slippery slope this country is on, and you seem to be cheering them on.