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Steve Bannon, former chief strategist to President Donald Trump, was arrested in New York Thursday on charges of using the viral “We Build the Wall” fundraising campaign to enrich himself.

LINK

Cornuck wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:00 am Add this to the "Only the best people" file.

Steve Bannon, former chief strategist to President Donald Trump, was arrested in New York Thursday on charges of using the viral “We Build the Wall” fundraising campaign to enrich himself.

LINK

You mean this one?

STEVE BANNON
Steve Bannon has been charged with defrauding Trump supporters in a campaign to help build the president’s signature wall along the U.S.-Mexico border, prosecutors said on Thursday.
Bannon served as a top adviser to Donald Trump’s presidential campaign and later worked as White House chief strategist before leaving the administration in August 2017.

ROGER STONE
Roger Stone, Trump’s longtime friend and adviser, was convicted of lying under oath to lawmakers investigating Russian interference in the 2016 U.S. election.
A Washington jury in November 2019 convicted Stone on all seven criminal counts of obstruction of a congressional investigation, five counts of making false statements to Congress, and tampering with a witness.
The day before Stone was due to report to prison to begin serving a sentence of three years and four months, Trump commuted his sentence.

PAUL MANAFORT
Trump’s former campaign chairman Paul Manafort was found guilty of tax fraud and bank fraud in a jury trial in August 2018. A month later, he pleaded guilty to conspiracy charges related to money laundering, lobbying violations and witness tampering.
Prosecutors said he tried to conceal millions of dollars he was paid as a political consultant for pro-Russian Ukrainian politicians.
He was sentenced to seven-and-a-half years in prison and in May was released to finish his sentence at home due to the coronavirus pandemic.

MICHAEL COHEN
Trump’s former personal lawyer is serving a three-year prison sentence at home due to the coronavirus pandemic. He pleaded guilty in August 2018 to crimes including orchestrating ‘hush money’ payments before the 2016 election to women who had said they had sexual encounters with Trump.
Cohen also pleaded guilty in November 2018 to lying to Congress about negotiations concerning a proposed Trump Tower in Moscow, a project that never materialized. He said Trump implicitly directed him to lie about the project.
Trump has denied those allegations.

MICHAEL FLYNN
The retired Army lieutenant general served as Trump’s national security adviser for less than a month in 2017. He pleaded guilty that year to lying to the FBI about his interactions with Russia’s ambassador to the United States in the weeks before Trump took office.
He then accused the FBI of entrapping him and asked the judge to dismiss the charge. The Justice Department has denied the allegations of prosecutorial misconduct.
The U.S. Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit has yet to rule on the matter.

RICK GATES
The former deputy chairman of Trump’s campaign pleaded guilty in February 2018 to conspiracy against the United States and lying to investigators. Gates agreed to cooperate with former Special Counsel Robert Mueller and testified as a prosecution witness against Manafort, his former business partner, and Stone. Gates was sentenced in December 2019 to 45 days in jail.

GEORGE NADER
George Nader, an informal Trump adviser on foreign policy and witness in the Mueller investigation, was sentenced in June to 10 years in prison by a federal judge in Virginia. He pleaded guilty to possessing child pornography and bringing a boy to the United States for sex.

GEORGE PAPADOPOULOS
The former Trump campaign adviser was sentenced in September 2018 to 14 days in prison after pleading guilty in October 2017 to lying to the FBI about his contacts with Russian officials and a Maltese professor who told him the Russians had “dirt” on Clinton.


Yup. Only the best people.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa- ... SKBN25G1YU

After living in NY for 30 years and traveling the States there are a couple of points I would like to make. First, all democracies have scandals big and small. There is Russia and Trump and that energy has created so much conflict it is hard to grasp the size of it. America is polarized to an extent not seen since the Civil War fought over State rights.

Out of the energy created by conflict America grew to be the most powerful country on the planet. The polarization never went away, it just took a back seat. In the mean time the country created by a huge conflict called the Civil War, moved toward a time and place almost perfect if you were the right color.

The 50's and 60's may represent one of the world's most perfect moments. Unions were strong, America threw the Marshall plan at a defeated foe and totally saved Japan from its worst instincts. One man could support a family and the lower classes were lifted up into credit card heaven. Think of all they did. Even the moon had us walking on its surface.

Of course, there were awful deeds committed and the roots of the greed disease took hold as the example of the times referenced left all wanting more. Now a man and his wife can join together to make a family work and that covered much of the last part of the 20th century. Expectations were raised across the social spectrum but the new century has seen a change in how to create and support a family.

Something called the 'gig' economy has made itself known and this is the narrowing of the capitalistic way of life. Now many of us need more than one job to survive. Total strangers influence our thinking about matters outside the home. How odd, when you consider it, that Sean Hannity or Don Lemon should have such power over us.

Right now at this point in time, America is on the verge of some kind of rebirth. Hopefully this will lead to a less greedy society where the income of the majority stops being attacked and the top whatever percent do not own most of the value. I believe the idea of government for sale has its function in any democracy but when it becomes the master there needs to be a change and it is coming.

Folks seem to invest themselves deeply in being on the right or the left. The reason is this is basic and affected me for some time. Simply put, belonging to an idea gives certainty to the holder of such passions. the world is a scary place and the universe....,.well...fuggetabout it.

I know i have rattled on but I have developed a perspective that does not need my emotions to agree with it. I have fought on this thread and when I read some of my older posts I wonder what on Earth I was in such a lather for? I can remember reading some of our thinking adn being inflamed to such a degree it affected my day and the day of those around me.

Do not get me wrong. I love to fight but I want my brain to be in charge instead of my deep need to be on the winning side. I admire the tremendous work some of us put into our posts. A million links are not going to change anyone's mind as the source is always suspect of being on the other side.

Getting my info from emotions is the way of an idiot and I fully belong in this category. Did it make me happy? DId it help me have peace in my life. Does it help do the job of love that is so needed today? I have two daughters and a grandson left in NY and when I see the armed supporters of this and that show up in public I worry for the innocents who will get crushed if the conflict goes in that direction.

I now live on The Sunshine Coast and am alone with my dog. The border is closed for visitors and our planned family vacation has been postponed. We are in a pandemic, we are in a place that calls for careful thought and respect for truth. As we cheer for one side or the other it is well to recall the idea of conflict as the mother of change and our loyalty to various positions counts for little.

It is the conflict that creates and it will be good for some and shite for others.

Per wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 5:19 am

Strangelove wrote: ↑Mon Aug 17, 2020 3:26 pm

Per wrote: ↑Sun Aug 16, 2020 11:22 pm

Strangelove wrote: ↑Sun Aug 16, 2020 5:06 pm
“Look at the facts… Paid off porn star… Russia lies… Racism… Children in cages… Conspiracy theories.”

Stormy Daniels eventually admitted she never actually had an affair with "My orange hero"

Source on that?

So why did he pay her USD 130,000 from campaign funds?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stormy_Da ... ite_note-1

"Daniels later signed a statement witnessed by both her lawyer and publicist denying that she had an affair with Trump."

(check the link in that article for more info if you like, also google is your friend)

And it wasn't Trump who paid the $130K, it was Cohen.

(Remember? Cohen was the one convicted of wrongdoing, not "My orange hero")

Crazy Mika... and apparently you... are still accusing Donny of things he has long been cleared!

Apparently Cohen paid her off because he couldn't get ahold of Don in the midst of the hectic campaign.

(Stormy came out of the woodwork a few weeks before the election, threatening to go public with her lies)

OK, couple of things...

1) Mika (is that her name?) stated that Trump paid off a porn star.
Not that he had an affair with said porn star.

Cohen paid Stormy 130,000 in hush money on Donnie's behalf.
Donnie later reimbursed Cohen, thus confirming that it was on his behalf.

Thus the statement can be confirmed to be true.

Let's keep things in their proper perspective okay?

This exchange was started by yours truly mocking Mika for her reasons given for her rage expressed in the video clip, which starts with:

“There’s clear disdain that I have for this President. Look at how he’s worn us down from his paid-off porn star to his…”

That is all she said about Stormy Daniels.

Yeah, there's no reason for "disdain" there, and if the Stormy story "wore her down" she needs psychiatric help IMPO.

Therefore: Mocking justified!

But what you're talking about here is my response to something YOU said.

YOU said the $130K came from campaign funds. YOU were wrong.

YOU doubted me when I said Stormy admitted she never actually had an affair with "My orange hero". YOU were wrong again!

And now YOU are claiming Donny reimbursing Cohen confirmed it was on his behalf. Wrong again! (well misleading is a better word).

See, whether he liked it or not, Don had to reimburse Cohen because Cohen had been given authority pay out money as he saw fit.

(and then be reimbursed for dat dere)

So Trump never made a decision to give Stormy $130K, and yet he was legally obliged to reimburse Cohen.

Per wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 5:19 am 2) Checking your source, the written statement that she had not had a relationship with Trump was mentioned in an article published on Jan 31st 2018.

On March 25th, 2018, Stormy was on 60 minutes, confirming that she had met with Trump twice, but only had sex with him on the first occassion, after first spanking him with a copy of Forbes magazine. She also mentioned that her former business advisor/lawyer had forced her to sign several false statements about her relations with Trump. Possibly referring to those mentioned in the article on Jan 31st?
(this is on the same wikipedia page you linked to)

Stormy Daniels obviously has a habit of talking out of her ass.

Of course you (and Mika) believe the parts of her conflicting stories that suit you.

And hey, that's your right!

But neither you nor Mika have the right to go around stating it's a fact Stormy and Don ever had sexual relations.

Per wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 5:19 am So yeah, she obviously had sex with him. Why else would he have paid her the hush money?

.... aaaand there he goes again!

Again, "he" didn't pay her the money, and Cohen paid her off because

... she was going to go public 3 weeks before the election.

I don't know if Cohen believed her or not, but he knew the timing could be disastrous for Don's Presidential hopes.

Per wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 5:19 am If it were political she would not have taken the hsh money to begin with.

What??

UMMMMM it was a made up story, it was extortion.

Per wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 5:19 am

Strangelove wrote: ↑Mon Aug 17, 2020 3:26 pm 3) (Remember? Cohen was the one convicted of wrongdoing, not "My orange hero")

Ah, but that is just because the consitution protects a sitting president from prosecution.

There is little chance that the department would file charges against Mr. Trump, regardless of what the evidence shows, because its Office of Legal Counsel has opined that the Constitution makes sitting presidents immune from prosecution.

But Mr. Cohen, after the raid last month, is under intense legal pressure.

Once Donnie is out of office, the prosecutor can choose to charge him for the same offences that Cohen was committed of doing on his behalf, if the statute of limitations has not expired by that time, that is.

Fantasize all you like, but you have zero evidence in the real world that Donny did anything wrong here.

Per wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 5:19 am

Strangelove wrote: ↑Mon Aug 17, 2020 3:26 pm

Per wrote: ↑Sun Aug 16, 2020 11:22 pm

Strangelove wrote: ↑Sun Aug 16, 2020 5:06 pm … no Russia lies,

Uhm... some seven, iirc, people with ties to the Trump campaign have been convicted in a court of law for lying about Russia.
But you know better?

AGAIN

... President Trump had nothing to do with that!

Trump had NOTHING to do with the Trump election campaign????!!!!!

You're accusing him of being a... uhm... sock puppet...? Marionette...? Manchurian candidate...?

Now you're just being silly, you know damn well Sweet Donny can't control folks choosing to lie to investigators on various things.

Per wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 5:19 am

Strangelove wrote: ↑Mon Aug 17, 2020 3:26 pm AGAIN... Mika was accusing "My orange hero" of "Russia lies".

As you know, this has been thoroughly investigated and Lord Trump came out smelling like a rose...

Sure... I know there are some yellow roses that really smell like shit.

And again, there was ample evidence that the Russians interfered with the election to benefit Trump.

True, but it was never established whether their efforts actually helped Trump to any substantial degree.

Per wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 5:19 am What they had problems proving was that the Russian actions were coordinated with the Trump campaign.

That's right, they spent years and billions of dollars and years looking for something, anything and found nothing nada zilch.

And now the witch-hunters are the ones under investigation for starting this debacle in the first place.

Per wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 5:19 am Yet they found enough evidence of wrong doing to put some of his cronies behind bars, albeit he has of course pardoned several of them already...

He pardoned them because it has been established it was a witch hunt.

And btw that "wrong doing" had nothing to do with any of them coordinating with the Russkies to help "My orange hero" win.

Per wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 5:19 am Just as we all know Bill Clinton did have sexual relations with that woman, Miss Lewinsky, we also all know that Trump did collude with Russia.

WOW, you're really out there aren't ya pal.

Nothing. Nada. Zilch.

Get some help...

Per wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 5:19 am

Strangelove wrote: ↑Mon Aug 17, 2020 3:26 pm (btw just how the fuck does one twist "the birtherism (sic) shit" into something racist?)

If you cannot see how racist that is, to ridiculously claim that a non white candidate cannot be a true American, then I don't really see the point in discussing this. But I assume that you are, per usual, just trolling, so here goes...

Has any white presidential candidate ever had his birth certificate questioned?

His mother was from effing Kansas.
Got knocked up by an exchange student at college.
Why the hell would she go to Kenya to give birth?
Never mind that the father already had a wife in Kenya... so he surely wouldn't want to bring her there...

It is so ridiculously stupid no sane person would ever give it the time of the day.
But it works just fine as a racist dog whistle for nefarious political motives.

And of course Trump would go there.

Oh, because Oblahblah is black, any/all accusations against him must be racist??

I submit Lord Trump would speak out against ANYONE running for Prez who he thought was ineligible, regardless of race, colour, or creed.

YOU are a racist.

BTW you still haven't addressed my entire post.

Strangelove wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:22 pm

Per wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 5:19 am

Strangelove wrote: ↑Mon Aug 17, 2020 3:26 pm 3) (Remember? Cohen was the one convicted of wrongdoing, not "My orange hero")

Ah, but that is just because the consitution protects a sitting president from prosecution.

There is little chance that the department would file charges against Mr. Trump, regardless of what the evidence shows, because its Office of Legal Counsel has opined that the Constitution makes sitting presidents immune from prosecution.

But Mr. Cohen, after the raid last month, is under intense legal pressure.

Once Donnie is out of office, the prosecutor can choose to charge him for the same offences that Cohen was committed of doing on his behalf, if the statute of limitations has not expired by that time, that is.

Fantasize all you like, but you have zero evidence in the real world that Donny did anything wrong here.

Now you are just being obtuse on purpose. Do I need to explain this to you one more time?

Cohen paid Stormy to be quiet ahead of the elections. You yourself claim it was with the explicit purpose to influence the outcome of the election (Cohen paid her off because ... she was going to go public 3 weeks before the election. I don't know if Cohen believed her or not, but he knew the timing could be disastrous for Don's Presidential hopes.), thus under law, this is money contributed to the Trump campaign by Cohen.

The amount is higher than what an individual is allowed to contribute, and thus a violation of campaign financing laws, even if considered a loan. Now, I don't know the details of how a candidate should address that, but the main thing here is that Trump did not address it. Instead he tried to sweep it under the rug.

The payment to Stormy by Cohen was all over the media by January, so even if Cohen had not talked to Trump ahead of the payment or asked for reimbursement after the fact, by this time there is no way to claim Trump did not know of it.

Once he knew of it, he must either list this as a campaign contribution and report it as such, or - if it is not a campaign contribution - he must report it to the Office of Government Ethics as un outstanding loan or obligation higher than USD 10,000 owed by him personally. He did neither.

In fact, his 2017 financial disclosure form — which he signed in June of 2018, certifying it was “true, complete and correct” — does not list any outstanding loan from Mr. Cohen, campaign-related or otherwise.

This means that he was either in breach of the campaign finance laws or the laws regarding government ethics.
Both are prosecutable offences.

Strangelove wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:22 pm

Per wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 5:19 am And again, there was ample evidence that the Russians interfered with the election to benefit Trump.

True, but it was never established whether their efforts actually helped Trump to any substantial degree.

Per wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 5:19 am What they had problems proving was that the Russian actions were coordinated with the Trump campaign.

That's right, they spent years and billions of dollars and years looking for something, anything and found nothing nada zilch.

Oh, they found a lot. Read the Mueller report!

Only, it is mostly circumstantial evidence, but heaps of it. The only thing missing was a smoking gun.

There was a lot of contact between key players in Trump's campaign and different Russian players. And they lied about these contacts.
But there was no clear evidence that they were coordinating efforts to influence the election.

Strangelove wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:22 pmAnd now the witch-hunters are the ones under investigation for starting this debacle in the first place.

Now THAT is the real witch hunt!

If the FBI has massive evidence that Russia is intervening in the US presidential elections, OF COURSE they need to investigate.
Anything else would have been a joke. Proof of the USA as a failed state.

To claim that the FBI did anything wrong in following up on all leads is just silly,
And they found evidence of a lot of criminal activity, enough to land several people in jail, so obviously not a witch hunt.

Strangelove wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:22 pm

Per wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 5:19 am Yet they found enough evidence of wrong doing to put some of his cronies behind bars, albeit he has of course pardoned several of them already...

He pardoned them because it has been established it was a witch hunt.

They were convicted in a court of law, given every opportunity to defend themselves against the evidence brought forth by the prosecutor. Are you saying the justice system in the USA is so flawed that even major political players lack the means to properly defend themselves in an open and fair trial!

Those are some serious accusations!

And btw that "wrong doing" had nothing to do with any of them coordinating with the Russkies to help "My orange hero" win.

Roger Stone was convicted of lying under oath, seven counts of obstructing the investigation, five counts of lying to congress and one case of witness tampering. All these crimes directly connected to the Russia investigation.
And then Trump rewarded him for all this criminal behaviour (on his behalf) by commuting the sentence. Now THAT is corruption!

Manafort was mainly convicted of money laundering, bank and tax fraud, but we can conclude that he was receiving huge amounts of money from Russian and pro-Russian sources in Ukraine while serving as Trump's campaign manager.
Once again, no smoking gun regarding collution, but DAMN!

Cohen was mainly convicted of violating campaign finance laws but also for lying to congress about the negotiations surrounding Trump Tower Moscow. According to his testimony he was instructed by Trump to do this.
Once again, no smoking gun, but related to Trump's financial involvement with Russian authorities.

Michael Flynn pleaded guilty to lying to the FBI about his interactions with Russia's ambassador to the USA before Trump took office.

Rick Gates, deputy chairman of Trump's campaign, pleaded guilty to conspiracy against the United States (sic!) and lying to investigators during the Russia investigation.

George Papadopoulos was convicted of lying to the FBI about his contacts with Russian officials to obtain dirt on Clinton.

Yeah, none of this had anything to do with "coordinating with the Russkies"...!

It's like when you find a dismembered body in the trunk of someone's car, but with no fingerprints, no evidence of any kind, no certain cause of death. You are pretty sure that a murder has been committed, but all you can prove is possession of a dead body, and the car's owner claims he has no idea how it got there.

I give you Nader though. He was convicted of kiddie porn possession and sex trafficking.
That probably didn't have anything to do with colluding with Russia.

Strangelove wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:22 pm

Per wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 5:19 am

Strangelove wrote: ↑Mon Aug 17, 2020 3:26 pm (btw just how the fuck does one twist "the birtherism (sic) shit" into something racist?)

If you cannot see how racist that is, to ridiculously claim that a non white candidate cannot be a true American, then I don't really see the point in discussing this. But I assume that you are, per usual, just trolling, so here goes...
Has any white presidential candidate ever had his birth certificate questioned?

His mother was from effing Kansas.
Got knocked up by an exchange student at college.
Why the hell would she go to Kenya to give birth?
Never mind that the father already had a wife in Kenya... so he surely wouldn't want to bring her there...

It is so ridiculously stupid no sane person would ever give it the time of the day.
But it works just fine as a racist dog whistle for nefarious political motives.

And of course Trump would go there.

Oh, because Oblahblah is black, any/all accusations against him must be racist??

Lol!

I didn't expect you to pull that card; I thought that was reserved for card carrying racists...


No, of course not. Valid criticism regarding his policies, his accomplishments, etc, would most likely have nothing to do with racism.

"He ain't white. He can't be A Mer'kin. He looks like he was born in Kenya!", on the other hand, is racist.

I submit Lord Trump would speak out against ANYONE running for Prez who he thought was ineligible, regardless of race, colour, or creed.

I mean, sure, you can argue the motive wasn't racist but Macchiavellian, win at all costs (I'm sure Trump always fights dirty, he even cheats at golf), but the chosen weapon in this instance was racism.

Strangelove wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:22 pm BTW you still haven't addressed my entire post.

Well, the bulk of your post was about the psychological well-being of some to me unknown talkinghead on American TV.

I don't know her, I don't know how she is doing and I frankly don't care.
So I just disregarded all of that.

It's amazing Per gets any work done, writing all these posts. Then again, it is a government job

Per wrote: ↑Fri Aug 21, 2020 1:08 am

Strangelove wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:22 pm Fantasize all you like, but you have zero evidence in the real world that Donny did anything wrong here.

Now you are just being obtuse on purpose. Do I need to explain this to you one more time?

Cohen paid Stormy to be quiet ahead of the elections. You yourself claim it was with the explicit purpose to influence the outcome of the election (Cohen paid her off because ... she was going to go public 3 weeks before the election. I don't know if Cohen believed her or not, but he knew the timing could be disastrous for Don's Presidential hopes.), thus under law, this is money contributed to the Trump campaign by Cohen.

The amount is higher than what an individual is allowed to contribute, and thus a violation of campaign financing laws, even if considered a loan. Now, I don't know the details of how a candidate should address that, but the main thing here is that Trump did not address it. Instead he tried to sweep it under the rug.

The payment to Stormy by Cohen was all over the media by January, so even if Cohen had not talked to Trump ahead of the payment or asked for reimbursement after the fact, by this time there is no way to claim Trump did not know of it.

Once he knew of it, he must either list this as a campaign contribution and report it as such, or - if it is not a campaign contribution - he must report it to the Office of Government Ethics as un outstanding loan or obligation higher than USD 10,000 owed by him personally. He did neither.

In fact, his 2017 financial disclosure form — which he signed in June of 2018, certifying it was “true, complete and correct” — does not list any outstanding loan from Mr. Cohen, campaign-related or otherwise.

This means that he was either in breach of the campaign finance laws or the laws regarding government ethics.

Both are prosecutable offences.

"Both are prosecutable offences."

You just summed up what the Obama campaign did multiple times!

And for that the Obama 2008 campaign was fined $375,000.

https://www.politico.com/story/2013/01/ ... 000-085784

The fact that "My orange hero" was fully investigated for what YOU claim were "prosecutable offences"

... and the FEC investigators found no reason to even fine him, tells you all you need to know on this matter.

You're just an angry old man yelling at a cloud for something that happened 2 years ago Per.

Sad!

Per wrote: ↑Fri Aug 21, 2020 1:46 am

Strangelove wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:22 pm

Per wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 5:19 am And again, there was ample evidence that the Russians interfered with the election to benefit Trump.

True, but it was never established whether their efforts actually helped Trump to any substantial degree.

Per wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 5:19 am What they had problems proving was that the Russian actions were coordinated with the Trump campaign.

That's right, they spent years and billions of dollars and years looking for something, anything and found nothing nada zilch.

Oh, they found a lot. Read the Mueller report!

Only, it is mostly circumstantial evidence...

Soooo yup....

Nothing. Nada. Zilch.

Per wrote: ↑Fri Aug 21, 2020 1:46 am

Strangelove wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:22 pmAnd now the witch-hunters are the ones under investigation for starting this debacle in the first place.

Now THAT is the real witch hunt!

LMAO at the shoe being on the other foot!

Per wrote: ↑Fri Aug 21, 2020 1:46 am

Strangelove wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:22 pm

Per wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 5:19 am Yet they found enough evidence of wrong doing to put some of his cronies behind bars, albeit he has of course pardoned several of them already...

He pardoned them because it has been established it was a witch hunt.

They were convicted in a court of law, given every opportunity to defend themselves against the evidence brought forth by the prosecutor. Are you saying the justice system in the USA is so flawed that even major political players lack the means to properly defend themselves in an open and fair trial!

Those are some serious accusations!

... well I'm a very serious guy!

The key phrase there is "fair trial"... which is exactly why the witch-hunters are now themselves being hunted.

And yeah sure, sometimes a small segment of the justice system in every nation of the world fails due to some form of corruption.

And Per? Trump Derangement Syndrome has apparently driven many o' Trump-hater to a life of corruption my friend!

Per wrote: ↑Fri Aug 21, 2020 1:46 am *this guy, that guy blah blah blah*

Yeah, none of this had anything to do with "coordinating with the Russkies"...!

UMMMMM. That's right, the wrong-doing they uncovered had nothing to do with the original intent of the investigation.

Saaay, you're not very good at this whole "debating" thing, are ya Per?

Per wrote: ↑Fri Aug 21, 2020 2:09 am

Strangelove wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:22 pm

Per wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 5:19 am

Strangelove wrote: ↑Mon Aug 17, 2020 3:26 pm (btw just how the fuck does one twist "the birtherism (sic) shit" into something racist?)

If you cannot see how racist that is, to ridiculously claim that a non white candidate cannot be a true American, then I don't really see the point in discussing this. But I assume that you are, per usual, just trolling, so here goes...
Has any white presidential candidate ever had his birth certificate questioned?

His mother was from effing Kansas.
Got knocked up by an exchange student at college.
Why the hell would she go to Kenya to give birth?
Never mind that the father already had a wife in Kenya... so he surely wouldn't want to bring her there...

It is so ridiculously stupid no sane person would ever give it the time of the day.
But it works just fine as a racist dog whistle for nefarious political motives.

And of course Trump would go there.

Oh, because Oblahblah is black, any/all accusations against him must be racist??

Lol!

I didn't expect you to pull that card; I thought that was reserved for card carrying racists...

And I didn't expect you to pull the racist card; I thought overplay of the racist card was reserved for paranoid/racist visible minority folk.

Per wrote: ↑Fri Aug 21, 2020 2:09 am No, of course not. Valid criticism regarding his policies, his accomplishments, etc, would most likely have nothing to do with racism.

Well in this case it had to do with the question at the time of whether Oblahblah was eligible to hold the office of POTUS

... but yes, you just described Sweet Donny to a tee!

Per wrote: ↑Fri Aug 21, 2020 2:09 am

Strangelove wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:22 pm I submit Lord Trump would speak out against ANYONE running for Prez who he thought was ineligible, regardless of race, colour, or creed.

I mean, sure, you can argue the motive wasn't racist but Macchiavellian, win at all costs (I'm sure Trump always fights dirty, he even cheats at golf), but the chosen weapon in this instance was racism.

You were doing alright until the last 8 words there... now you're back to square one.

LAST TIME: It is not "racist" to consider whether or not a politician is ineligible for office. FULL STOP

Per wrote: ↑Fri Aug 21, 2020 2:20 am

Strangelove wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:22 pm BTW you still haven't addressed my entire post.

Well, the bulk of your post was about the psychological well-being of some to me unknown talkinghead on American TV.

I don't know her, I don't know how she is doing and I frankly don't care.

So I just disregarded all of that.

Don't you get it man??

Mika is the female version of YOU!!

Strangelove wrote: ↑Fri Aug 21, 2020 4:37 pm

Per wrote: ↑Fri Aug 21, 2020 2:20 am

Strangelove wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:22 pm BTW you still haven't addressed my entire post.

Well, the bulk of your post was about the psychological well-being of some to me unknown talkinghead on American TV.

I don't know her, I don't know how she is doing and I frankly don't care.

So I just disregarded all of that.

Don't you get it man??

Mika is the female version of YOU!!

As I don’t know who she is, I can’t say that I do...

Maybe I should start posting about Swedish TV personalities that remind me of you...