Just Not ready

[5thhorseman]

I still don't understand why cars are connected to the internet at all. There is nothing my truck needs from the world wide web.

If you want to use Google maps to plan the quickest route, or see traffic levels, or stream Spotify, or use internet radio, or listen to podcasts.

Yeah I know it's actually your phone that's connected but there's no reason the infotainment system can't scrape that data if the Chinese want it.

[Meds]

Here is a crazy idea. Stop importing from our true adversaries (China, other communists, dictators, and Muslim theocracies). Let our prices rise. And quit funding our unsustainable poverty class with cheap shit made from their poverty/oppressed class.

What happens to our poverty class should this occur?

An increase prices will push more of the population into this poverty class.

Sure but we can put them on welfare with all the money we collected from the tariffs.

Tariffs, you say?

Yes. Give in to the darkside.

[Per]

Here is a crazy idea. Stop importing from our true adversaries (China, other communists, dictators, and Muslim theocracies). Let our prices rise. And quit funding our unsustainable poverty class with cheap shit made from their poverty/oppressed class.

Yeah, import substitution has already been tried by Peronist Argentina, the Soviet Union, Pol Pot's Cambodia, Franco's Spain, Cuba and many others. It has always been a popular practice among dictators.

The outcome has always been disastrous. The protected industries start lagging behind producers in countries that still compete on a global market. Prices go up, quality goes down and the standard of living of the entire population suffers.

I mean, you can do some tweaking. Like adding tariffs on products that are subsidised through forced labour or lax environmental practices. But try to keep it at a minimum and definitely don't make a complete ban. It will hurt you more than the other guy as your industries grow fat, lazy and complacent. No need for product development when you have a monopoly.

[5thhorseman]

Here is a crazy idea. Stop importing from our true adversaries (China, other communists, dictators, and Muslim theocracies). Let our prices rise. And quit funding our unsustainable poverty class with cheap shit made from their poverty/oppressed class.

In what way are these countries our "adversaries"? Economically? Politically? Religiously? And is it realistic to think that not importing from them will change anything?

Sure, if they are trade practices that are adversarial (eg dumping) but that's what trade agreements are for. World trade is generally a win-win so if we are going to shoot ourselves in the foot by limiting our participation then we better have a damn good reason.

[Aaronp18]

Here is a crazy idea. Stop importing from our true adversaries (China, other communists, dictators, and Muslim theocracies). Let our prices rise. And quit funding our unsustainable poverty class with cheap shit made from their poverty/oppressed class.

What happens to our poverty class should this occur?

An increase prices will push more of the population into this poverty class.

Our non working poor stay poor, so they see no change but as we lower taxes, our working poor see a rise in their standard of living, and can more easily avoid being the non-working poor.
Our working poor also buy less lead painted cheap disposable shit (that's you dollar stores), so our landfills last longer.

We would have to make other changes. Reducing regulations, and reducing government competition in private enterprises, etc,but these are also necessary.

Before the flames start, there is a lot more details to it, but, yeah, we can, and should stop enriching our enemies, as they are using the money to kill us, and our allies.

Anybody want an economics101 thread?

Lower taxes will help somewhat for the working poor, but we will have to raise taxes on the upper class and close loopholes where the uber rich avoid paying taxes in order to maintain the services we currently expect and perhaps improve on them. And somehow encourage spending for the upper class.

We can't just lower taxes arbitrarily, services would need to be cut. Which again, would devastate the lower income people more than anyone else.

It's all connected to economics really.

Like you said, lots to figure out before torching it all.

[Topper]

Lower taxes will help somewhat for the working poor, but we will have to raise taxes on the upper class and close loopholes where the uber rich avoid paying taxes in order to maintain the services we currently expect and perhaps improve on them. And somehow encourage spending for the upper class.

We can't just lower taxes arbitrarily, services would need to be cut. Which again, would devastate the lower income people more than anyone else.

It's all connected to economics really.

Like you said, lots to figure out before torching it all.

We need to lower our expectations of what government provides. Governments role should be limited to establishing and enforcing a legal framework for society with an extremely limited role as a provider of goods and services.

The expansion of government into providing goods and services has been an unmitigated disaster of high cost inefficiency with a blank cheque.

[Per]

Lower taxes will help somewhat for the working poor, but we will have to raise taxes on the upper class and close loopholes where the uber rich avoid paying taxes in order to maintain the services we currently expect and perhaps improve on them. And somehow encourage spending for the upper class.

We can't just lower taxes arbitrarily, services would need to be cut. Which again, would devastate the lower income people more than anyone else.

It's all connected to economics really.

Like you said, lots to figure out before torching it all.

We need to lower our expectations of what government provides. Governments role should be limited to establishing and enforcing a legal framework for society with an extremely limited role as a provider of goods and services.

The expansion of government into providing goods and services has been an unmitigated disaster of high cost inefficiency with a blank cheque.

And yet when you look at the list of the happiest countries in the world, or the best countries to live in, the Nordic countries and Canada always make the top of the list.

Sure, no one is perfect, but we must be doing something right. Or at least not as poorly as others.

[5thhorseman]

Do education and health count as "goods and services"? I wouldn't be happy with either of these being privatized. I can't think of any country where this has been done with success.

Otherwise I agree with what Topper is saying.

[Aaronp18]

Do education and health count as "goods and services"? I wouldn't be happy with either of these being privatized. I can't think of any country where this has been done with success.

Otherwise I agree with what Topper is saying.

Yes I'm on the same page as well. I was referring to the public education and health care systems we have! Infrastructure as well.