Topper's Grilling Advice!

[UWSaint]

Gotta agree with the Chef on this one, Italian food is THE BEST!

I love Italian food, and yeah, when it's done right, preferrably by Italians, it is THE BEST.

Per: "I don't want Mexicans preparing food in my Italian Restaurant." That might even make Trump blush.

Aside from the cheap shot, the cult of authenticity with regard to food origin is absurd. How dare old world cuisine incorporate new world crops like tomatoes and potatoes!

Food tastes and trends change (or get tweaked) with every generation (at least in the US and Canada). Many wonderful food trends come from merging national cuisines or using locally available or available produce and meats as a substitute in recipes for what was available where the dish as initially created.

I get a kick out of "that's not how they do it in" country of origin claims that presuppose the best way to do it is within the country of origin. Last I checked, the United States and Canada are comprised of lots and lots of people with ancestors who came here precisely because that they believed that presumption was false -- or at least quite tenable. (claim here is not the food must be better, but you get the point -- sometimes what you have is not the best there is). More than that, people create new things all the time, including food. That some (likely) sicilian restauranter decided to take spaghetti and take meatballs and then put them on the same plate with a tomato sauce, doesn't give it a lesser value than the first Napolese dude who made up pasta e fagioli....

Last, I know that my maternal family, who came from sicily to New York, ate their fair share of spaghetti and meatballs when the native-born sicilians were still kicking it. Its pasta -- common as a first course -- combined with meatballs -- common as a main course -- combined. It was a staple for Italian-American working class immigrants. It filled you up, tasted good, and was cheap. That those same sicilian-born immigrants would have not had that dish in Italy means nothing normatively.

[Topper]

Gotta agree with the Chef on this one, Italian food is THE BEST!

I love Italian food, and yeah, when it's done right, preferrably by Italians, it is THE BEST.

Per: "I don't want Mexicans preparing food in my Italian Restaurant." That might even make Trump blush.

Aside from the cheap shot, the cult of authenticity with regard to food origin is absurd. How dare old world cuisine incorporate new world crops like tomatoes and potatoes!

Food tastes and trends change (or get tweaked) with every generation (at least in the US and Canada). Many wonderful food trends come from merging national cuisines or using locally available or available produce and meats as a substitute in recipes for what was available where the dish as initially created.

I get a kick out of "that's not how they do it in" country of origin claims that presuppose the best way to do it is within the country of origin. Last I checked, the United States and Canada are comprised of lots and lots of people with ancestors who came here precisely because that they believed that presumption was false -- or at least quite tenable. (claim here is not the food must be better, but you get the point -- sometimes what you have is not the best there is). More than that, people create new things all the time, including food. That some (likely) sicilian restauranter decided to take spaghetti and take meatballs and then put them on the same plate with a tomato sauce, doesn't give it a lesser value than the first Napolese dude who made up pasta e fagioli....

Last, I know that my maternal family, who came from sicily to New York, ate their fair share of spaghetti and meatballs when the native-born sicilians were still kicking it. Its pasta -- common as a first course -- combined with meatballs -- common as a main course -- combined. It was a staple for Italian-American working class immigrants. It filled you up, tasted good, and was cheap. That those same sicilian-born immigrants would have not had that dish in Italy means nothing normatively.

Add corn and turkey to the new world ingredients. I read a book on the history of Italian cuisine and it discussed the introduction of potatoes into the kitchen and it said there were pamphlets suggesting they be cooked and substituted for chestnuts. They also discussed Mussolini's attempt to purge the language of foreign words and in a very piognent sentence it was stated the Italians hadn't had a chance to learn Mussolini's preferred term before they had to learn the US English terms for their emergency rations. It is difficult to discuss Italian cuisine without mention of the the Medici family and the Church. The Church influence on salt fish for Fridays, the Medici, especially Catherine for the ties to France and the Papacy.

All in all, it is almost better to think of a Mediterranean Mezzo cuisine that evolved out of Persia.

The North African influence in Sicilian food probably make it my favourite though the restaurant I trained in specialized in Piedmont region.

When it comes to the kitchen, I am very much a traditionalist. There are reason's why some things work and others do not. Mixing and matching has to be within those bounds and most fusions are more confusion.

Tomato sauce is a completely wrong sauce for the shape of spaghetti. It is for a short stout pasta. Pasta shapes are designed around matching sauces.

I mentioned to a friend that the ultimate Canadian cuisine could be cabbage rolls with kimchi.

Where would Mexican food be without the French influence? Mayan cuisine may be the only vegetarian based cuisine to evolve.

[Per]

Gotta agree with the Chef on this one, Italian food is THE BEST!

I love Italian food, and yeah, when it's done right, preferrably by Italians, it is THE BEST.

Per: "I don't want Mexicans preparing food in my Italian Restaurant." That might even make Trump blush.

No, that would be a total waste, because if there is one thing this town could need, it’s a good Mexican restaurant!

There is some tex mex place, but they’re basically just serving the same pre-made stuff you can buy in the stores and prepare at home. I might get lucky though. There is a place opening soon with the name ”The Frozen Mexican”, and I’m keeping my fingers crossed it could be the real deal...

Seriously though, my qualifier was more that there are loads of ”Italian” restaurants that serve overcooked pasta with bland ragu, and you get a feeling the chef must never have tasted real Italian food. The best Italian food I have had has always been at restaurants run by actual Italians. Like the one I recommend in Camden.

[UWSaint]

Tomato sauce is a completely wrong sauce for the shape of spaghetti. It is for a short stout pasta. Pasta shapes are designed around matching sauces.

Now that's a relevant objection to spaghetti and meatballs.

And Per, nice pivot....

[Per]

And Per, nice pivot....

Well, I 've been working with MS Excel on a more or less daily basis since 1993....

[Puck]

Piedmont eh, Topper? Nice.

What's your go-to dish to serve with Barolo? ... other than Osso Buco - I haven't seen a lot of veal shank around lately.

[Puck]

Per/UW:
I agree with you both to a point. Any chef with good skills and experience from a quality kitchen should be able to do a good job with any cuisine. You may, however, want some someone with traditional experience to be head chef or manager. That restaurant in Camden could easily have a Mexican cook as part of the back of the house crew.

[Topper]

Piedmont eh, Topper? Nice.

What's your go-to dish to serve with Barolo? ... other than Osso Buco - I haven't seen a lot of veal shank around lately.

Try other shank meat. At the restaurant, the chef always had a variation of osso buco on the menu and it changed over time from veal, lamb, venison, bison...

I once heard a conversation speculating on using ostrich neck osso bucco.

He had a steak on the menu (for Americans LOL) that was tenderloin (flavourless) served on oxtail and lentils. You could also go with a game bird, pheasant is a personal favourite.

[Cousin Strawberry]

pheasant is a person favourite.

Hes probably is one of Per's 11000 expert climate scientists

[Topper]

pheasant is a person favourite.

Hes probably is one of Per's 11000 expert climate scientists

smoked and baked

[Cousin Strawberry]

pheasant is a person favourite.

Hes probably is one of Per's 11000 expert climate scientists

smoked and baked

Extra carbon on that breast

[Per]

pheasant is a person favourite.

Hes probably is one of Per's 11000 expert climate scientists

smoked and baked

Extra carbon on that breast

Fagiani carbonara.....

[Topper]

quote="Chef Boi RD" post_id=364839 time=1576380865 user_id=35]

Mother fucking baby back ribs, cane sugar rice.

I slow cooked baby back ribs in tomato sauce last week. I went ballistic on the ribs after. The sauce stains on the white under shirt that night was top notch!
[/quote]
Hate ribs or wings dripping in sauce.

Dry rub, wrapped tight on foil, 2 hrs at 375, cut open the foil and lightly char under the broiler.

[Chef Boi RD]

Slow cooked Ribs dripping in tomato sauce is top shelf.

Chef made Chana Marsala last night and a Beet and Daikon salad. Holy shit balls was it good.

Beet and Daikon salad

3 medium beets chopped small
4 oz Daikon chopped small
1 tomato chopped small
1/2 cup cilantro fine diced
Juice of half a lemon
Teaspoon of salt

[5thhorseman]

Hey Tops, when do you do a dry rub vs braising with a little bit of beer or wine?

My go to is a braise by spicing (salt, pepper, rosemary, thyme), searing on the q, covering in a dish with a 1/2 cup of liquid, oven @ 300 for 90, then 250 for another 90 or until easily coming off the bone. Could broil but have never bothered. No sauce.

I got a fairly sizable piece of goat neck and was wondering if you'd dry rub that. Or does it need to be more fatty?