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Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Posted: Mon Jun 03, 2019 7:32 pm
by Strangelove
https://pjmedia.com/trending/bernie-san ... -division/
Bernie Sanders Says 'There Is No Middle Ground,' Then Blames Trump for Division

"We have got to make it clear that when the future of the planet is at stake, there is no middle ground. We will take on the fossil fuel industry and transform our energy system," he began with a long list of "no middle ground" declarations. "We have got to make it clear that when this country drifts toward oligarchy, there is no middle ground. Large profitable corporations like Amazon will pay their fair share of taxes. When it comes to health care, there is no middle ground. Health care is a human right, not a privilege. And we will guarantee health care to all of our people through a Medicare-for-all single-payer system."

"When it comes to abortion, there is no middle ground. A woman has the right to control her own life, not the government," Sanders continued. "When it comes to prescription drugs, no middle ground. We’re going to take on the pharmaceutical industry, cut prescription drug prices in half. And when it comes to mass shootings and the fact that 40,000 people were killed last year with guns, no middle ground, we will take on the NRA. And when it comes to criminal justice reform and immigration reform, no middle ground. We will take on the prison-industrial complex. We will take on racism at the border. And when it comes to foreign policy, no middle ground. We will finally put an end to a bloated military budget and end endless wars."

"Brothers and sisters, Trump wants to divide us"
:lol: :lol: :lol:

Poor Bernie, apparently full blown communism makes a lot of sense when you've got full blown dementia....

Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Posted: Tue Jun 04, 2019 2:18 pm
by Per
Nobel laurate Paul Krugman on Trump's tariffs:
Donald Trump’s plan to impose tariffs on Mexican exports unless our neighbor does something — he hasn’t specified what — to stop the flow of asylum-seekers is almost surely illegal: U.S. trade law gives presidents discretion to impose tariffs for a number of reasons, but curbing immigration isn’t one of them.

It’s also a clear violation of U.S. international agreements. And it will reduce the living standards of most Americans, destroy many jobs in U.S. manufacturing, and hurt farmers.

But let’s put all of that to one side and talk about the really bad stuff.

Trump says that “TARIFF is a beautiful word indeed,” but the actual history of U.S. tariffs isn’t pretty — and not just because tariffs, whatever the tweeter in chief says, are in practice taxes on Americans, not foreigners. In fact, it’s now a good bet that Trump’s tariffs will more than wipe out whatever breaks middle-class Americans got from the 2017 tax cut.

The more important fact is that until the 1930s, tariff policy was a cesspool of corruption and special-interest politics. One of the main purposes of the 1934 Reciprocal Trade Agreements Act, which eventually became the template for the modern world trading system, was to drain that particular swamp by removing the capriciousness of previous tariff policy.

Trump’s erratic trade actions, unconstrained by what we used to think were the legal rules, have brought the capriciousness back, and good old-fashioned corruption ­— if it isn’t happening already — won’t be far behind.

Beyond that, tariff policy is inextricably linked with America’s role as a global superpower. Central to that role is the expectation that the U.S. will be both reliable and responsible — that it will honor whatever agreements it makes, and more broadly that it will make policy with an eye to the effects of its actions on the rest of the world.


Trump is throwing all that away. His Mexican tariffs violate both Nafta, which was supposed to guarantee free movement of goods within North America, and our obligations under the World Trade Organization, which, like U.S. law, permits new tariffs only under certain specified conditions. So America has become a lawless actor in world markets, a tariff-policy rogue state.

But there’s more. By deploying tariffs as a bludgeon against whatever he doesn’t like, Trump is returning America to the kind of irresponsibility it displayed after World War I — irresponsibility that, while obviously not the sole or even the main cause of the Great Depression, the rise of fascism and the eventual coming of World War II, helped create the environment for these disasters.

It is, I believe, pretty widely known that America turned its back on the world after World War I: refusing to join the League of Nations, slamming the doors shut on most immigration (fortunately a few years after my grandparents got here).

What’s less known, I suspect, is that America also took a sharply protectionist turn long before the infamous 1930 Smoot Hawley Act. In early 1921, Congress enacted the Emergency Tariff Act, soon followed by the Fordney-McCumber Tariff of 1922. These actions more than doubled average tariffs on dutiable imports. Like Trump, the advocates of these tariffs claimed that they would bring prosperity to all Americans.

They didn’t. There was indeed a manufacturing boom, driven not by tariffs but by new products like affordable cars and new technologies like the assembly line. Farmers, however, spent the 1920s suffering from low prices for their products and high prices for farm equipment, leading to a surge in foreclosures.

Part of the problem was that U.S. tariffs were met with retaliation; even before the Depression struck, the world was engaged in a gradually escalating trade war. Making things even worse, U.S. tariffs put our World War I allies in an impossible position: We expected them to repay their huge war debts, but our tariffs made it impossible for them to earn the dollars they needed to make those payments.

And the trade war/debt nexus created a climate of international distrust and bitterness that contributed to the economic and political crises of the 1930s. This experience had a profound effect on U.S. policy after World War II, which was based on the view that free trade and peace went hand in hand.

So am I saying that Trump is repeating the policy errors America made a century ago? No. This time it’s much worse.

After all, while Warren Harding wasn’t a very good president, he didn’t routinely abrogate international agreements in a fit of pique. While America in the 1920s failed to help build international institutions, it didn’t do a Trump and actively try to undermine them. And while U.S. leaders between the wars may have turned a blind eye to the rise of racist dictatorships, they generally didn’t praise those dictatorships and compare them favorably to democratic regimes.

There are, however, enough parallels between U.S. tariff policy in the 1920s and Trumpism today for us to have a pretty good picture of what happens when politicians think that tariffs are “beautiful.” And it’s ugly.
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/03/opin ... riffs.html

Sort of what I said earlier, but perhaps slightly more eloquent and with the added clout of having won a Nobel prize in economics. :thumbs:

Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Posted: Tue Jun 04, 2019 11:06 pm
by Per
Gotta love Jonathan Pie and his fuming summaries of the news! :lol:


Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Posted: Wed Jun 05, 2019 3:10 am
by Per
Per wrote:
Sun Jun 02, 2019 6:17 pm
Trump really likes his tariffs. The 25% tariffs on Chinese goods have just kicked in, and now he wants to impose tariffs on Mexican goods as well, unless they stop immigration from Central America to the US. Apart from it being a very poor idea to mix trade policies with migration issues, and definitely a wild breach of WTO rules, it doesn't really seem like Trump understands how tariffs work. Repeatedly he seems to state that the Chinese pay the tariffs on Chinese goods, and of course Mexico on Mexican goods. That's a complete misunderstanding of how tariffs work. Tariffs are a tax on imported goods, and (in the case of US tariffs) are paid by the American consumers. The democrats need to start hammering away on this. They should use the word import tax instead of tariffs when criticising these assinine measures, to help explain what Trump is doing.

Furthermore, because of how successful Nafta has been, manufactured goods often cross the US-Mexico border several times before they hit the shelves, which could mean, if things aren't handled right, that the tariffs could be multiplied and increase consumer prices even more than intended. I read somewhere that Mexican imports into the USA on average have 30% US content, which means that losses in sales due to the tariffs will also hit American companies; not to mention of course all the US companies that have outsourced production or assembly to Mexico...

Trump seems to think that somehow he can issue tariffs and then get money from the countries he imposes them on. Does he really not understand that the import tax is really paid by those who import the goods? And that they then pass it on to the consumer? Jeesus. I mean, sure, it hurts the country of origin in that they risk losing business as their products will become more expensive, but it hurts the consumer even more, and beyond that it can strike in rather unexpected ways. Say that all Chinese and Mexican products become 25% more expensive. Assuming that the consumer still needs to buy these products and cannot find a cheaper substitute, it leaves them with less spending capacity, which means they may opt out from going to the movies, restaurants or buying a new car. This will strike randomly at local businesses and will create job losses in America.

It's just crazy. And he needs to get called out on it. I don't get how the republicans can put up with it.
They used to be a free trade and low taxes party, and he seems to be reversing that.
Yet hardly anyone has the balls to stand up for the conservative core beliefs that he is pissing on.
My bad. Apparently a whole lot of republican senators are considering blocking the Mexican tariffs:
The president warned Republicans in Congress not to block his efforts. “I don’t think they will do that. I think if they do, it’s foolish,” he said.

But Republican senators warned that the White House may not have their backing, with Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell saying there was “not much support” among other Republicans for the tariffs. The threat has spooked global markets and put the ratification of a three-way trade pact between the two countries and Canada that took over a year to negotiate in doubt.

The tariffs have also been criticized by the U.S. Chamber of Commerce and industry groups on concerns about increased costs for U.S. businesses and consumers.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa- ... SKCN1T51GR
Hopefully the remaining sane republicans in Congress will have the balls to block this idiocy! :thumbs:

There are apparently still some conservatives left, and not just tea party nutjobs.
And in regard to the latter. it should be noted that the original Boston Tea Party was really a protest against tariffs on tea.

Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Posted: Wed Jun 05, 2019 12:31 pm
by Strangelove
Per wrote:
Wed Jun 05, 2019 3:10 am
Hopefully the remaining sane republicans in Congress will have the balls to block this idiocy!
Idiocy?

The Donald is merely applying pressure on Mexico.

Patience grasshopper, try to see the big picture...

Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Posted: Thu Jun 06, 2019 8:29 pm
by Strangelove
Strangelove wrote:
Wed Jun 05, 2019 12:31 pm
Per wrote:
Wed Jun 05, 2019 3:10 am
Hopefully the remaining sane republicans in Congress will have the balls to block this idiocy!
Idiocy?

The Donald is merely applying pressure on Mexico.

Patience grasshopper, try to see the big picture...
UPDATE:

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news ... mmigration
Mexican president sends delegation after Trump threatens tariffs over illegal immigration

Mexico’s President Andrés Manuel López Obrador said Thursday that his administration would be sending a delegation to the United States after Trump threatened to impose tariffs on Mexico if they did not stop the influx of illegal immigration.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa- ... T62YC?il=0
Mexico meets migrants at southern border with armed forces

MEXICO CITY (Reuters) - Mexican soldiers, armed police and migration officials blocked hundreds of migrants after they crossed the border from Guatemala in a caravan into southern Mexico on Wednesday, and detained dozens of them, a witness from a migrant aid group and an official said.
Si we cann seniooooor....

Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Posted: Fri Jun 07, 2019 6:45 pm
by Strangelove
Strangelove wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 8:29 pm
Strangelove wrote:
Wed Jun 05, 2019 12:31 pm
Per wrote:
Wed Jun 05, 2019 3:10 am
Hopefully the remaining sane republicans in Congress will have the balls to block this idiocy!
Idiocy?

The Donald is merely applying pressure on Mexico.

Patience grasshopper, try to see the big picture...
UPDATE:

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news ... mmigration
Mexican president sends delegation after Trump threatens tariffs over illegal immigration

Mexico’s President Andrés Manuel López Obrador said Thursday that his administration would be sending a delegation to the United States after Trump threatened to impose tariffs on Mexico if they did not stop the influx of illegal immigration.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa- ... T62YC?il=0
Mexico meets migrants at southern border with armed forces

MEXICO CITY (Reuters) - Mexican soldiers, armed police and migration officials blocked hundreds of migrants after they crossed the border from Guatemala in a caravan into southern Mexico on Wednesday, and detained dozens of them, a witness from a migrant aid group and an official said.
Si we cann seniooooor....

UPDATE:

https://www.apnews.com/e18f85f3f23f4fdea76831c80540af15
WASHINGTON (AP) — President Donald Trump says he has suspended plans to impose tariffs on Mexico, tweeting that the country “has agreed to take strong measures” to stem the flow of Central American migrants into the United States.

“I am pleased to inform you that The United States of America has reached a signed agreement with Mexico,” Trump tweeted Friday night, saying the “Tariffs scheduled to be implemented by the U.S. on Monday, against Mexico, are hereby indefinitely suspended.”

He said Mexico has agreed to work to “stem the tide of Migration through Mexico, and to our Southern Border” and said those steps would “greatly reduce, or eliminate, Illegal Immigration coming from Mexico and into the United States.”

He said details would be released soon by the State Department.
YEEEEUP, yup, yup, yup, yup...

Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Posted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 9:01 am
by ukcanuck
Strangelove wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 6:45 pm
Strangelove wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 8:29 pm
Strangelove wrote:
Wed Jun 05, 2019 12:31 pm
Per wrote:
Wed Jun 05, 2019 3:10 am
Hopefully the remaining sane republicans in Congress will have the balls to block this idiocy!
Idiocy?

The Donald is merely applying pressure on Mexico.

Patience grasshopper, try to see the big picture...
UPDATE:

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news ... mmigration
Mexican president sends delegation after Trump threatens tariffs over illegal immigration

Mexico’s President Andrés Manuel López Obrador said Thursday that his administration would be sending a delegation to the United States after Trump threatened to impose tariffs on Mexico if they did not stop the influx of illegal immigration.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa- ... T62YC?il=0
Mexico meets migrants at southern border with armed forces

MEXICO CITY (Reuters) - Mexican soldiers, armed police and migration officials blocked hundreds of migrants after they crossed the border from Guatemala in a caravan into southern Mexico on Wednesday, and detained dozens of them, a witness from a migrant aid group and an official said.
Si we cann seniooooor....

UPDATE:

https://www.apnews.com/e18f85f3f23f4fdea76831c80540af15
WASHINGTON (AP) — President Donald Trump says he has suspended plans to impose tariffs on Mexico, tweeting that the country “has agreed to take strong measures” to stem the flow of Central American migrants into the United States.

“I am pleased to inform you that The United States of America has reached a signed agreement with Mexico,” Trump tweeted Friday night, saying the “Tariffs scheduled to be implemented by the U.S. on Monday, against Mexico, are hereby indefinitely suspended.”

He said Mexico has agreed to work to “stem the tide of Migration through Mexico, and to our Southern Border” and said those steps would “greatly reduce, or eliminate, Illegal Immigration coming from Mexico and into the United States.”

He said details would be released soon by the State Department.
YEEEEUP, yup, yup, yup, yup...
So what, now they don’t need a wall? They don’t need to separate children from parents and keep them in camps now?

That’d Be great.


But wait why would the US have to strong arm Mexico into trying reduce the flow of refugees? Wouldn’t they also not enjoy this caravan of drug dealers and gangsters and coyotes raping and pillaging their way across Mexico anyway?

Perhaps they haven’t done as trump wanted because they can’t?

Last I heard, southern Mexico was a lawless wasteland where the government has almost zero presence. So sending the Mexican army (such as it is) south to do something about will be ineffective and likely to fail.

As for sending the federalis to the northern border that’s great for Mexico but how does it help the Americans ?

Seems to me the whole shebang from the mysterious armada of illegal immigrants, to the building of the wall to forcing the Mexicans to shuck and jive is just meant to keep his base in post orgasmic glow.

Meh. wake me up when he solves a real problem

Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Posted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 9:20 am
by Strangelove
ukcanuck wrote:
Mon Jun 10, 2019 9:01 am
So what, now they don’t need a wall?
Why would you say such a thing.

ukcanuck wrote:
Mon Jun 10, 2019 9:01 am
They don’t need to separate children from parents and keep them in camps now?

That’d Be great.
Wake up, parents who commit all sorts of crimes have always been separated from their children

... and btw this was happening with illegals on Obama's watch as well... you brainwashed stooge. :mex:

ukcanuck wrote:
Mon Jun 10, 2019 9:01 am
But wait why would the US have to strong arm Mexico into trying reduce the flow of refugees? Wouldn’t they also not enjoy this caravan of drug dealers and gangsters and coyotes raping and pillaging their way across Mexico anyway?
I dunno, because they didn't want to fill up their jails and have to build more?

They'd rather let them pass on through and become America's problem?

ukcanuck wrote:
Mon Jun 10, 2019 9:01 am
Perhaps they haven’t done as trump wanted because they can’t?
Trump said Mexico could do more and now Mexico is doing more.

Trump is a stable genius.

ukcanuck wrote:
Mon Jun 10, 2019 9:01 am
Last I heard, southern Mexico was a lawless wasteland where the government has almost zero presence. So sending the Mexican army (such as it is) south to do something about will be ineffective and likely to fail.
Trump said Mexico could do more and now Mexico is doing more.

ukcanuck wrote:
Mon Jun 10, 2019 9:01 am
As for sending the federalis to the northern border that’s great for Mexico but how does it help the Americans ?
:scowl:

ukcanuck wrote:
Mon Jun 10, 2019 9:01 am
Seems to me the whole shebang from the mysterious armada of illegal immigrants, to the building of the wall to forcing the Mexicans to shuck and jive is just meant to keep his base in post orgasmic glow.
Whatever helps you sleep 24/7 I suppose...

ukcanuck wrote:
Mon Jun 10, 2019 9:01 am
Meh. wake me up when he solves a real problem
There are none so blind as brainwashed stooges.

Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 2:39 pm
by ukcanuck
ukcanuck wrote: ↑
They don’t need to separate children from parents and keep them in camps now?

That’d Be great.
Wake up, parents who commit all sorts of crimes have always been separated from their children

... and btw this was happening with illegals on Obama's watch as well... you brainwashed stooge. :mex:
Interesting that you would phrase it like that?


it’s really the innocent children who are being separated and for one who by definition has no trust in government organizations how much faith do you have that these children will ever be reunited with their families?

As for this happening under Obama, is that supposed to make it right ?
It either way, I don’t think the democrats were imprisoning children at the same rate as trump’s republicans have but how anyone could think the practice is acceptable is pretty sad regardless whether it’s the democrats or republicans.


As for solving the immigration crisis, trump could stop his country from fucking around in central and South American countries which would do far more to stop people from fleeing for their lives in the first place.

And any number of social programs are available to alleviate the impact of immigrants already in the country.

Those two things would cost far less and be way less divisive.

Too bad republicans are wired to help themselves not people.

Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 3:03 pm
by Strangelove
ukcanuck wrote:
Tue Jun 11, 2019 2:39 pm
Orange man bad!
The uninformed blathering of a brainwashed stooge...

Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 11:02 pm
by Per
Strangelove wrote:
Tue Jun 11, 2019 3:03 pm
ukcanuck wrote:
Tue Jun 11, 2019 2:39 pm
Orange man bad!
The uninformed blathering of a brainwashed stooge...
... contrasted by the chatter of an enthusiastic minion.

Image

Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Posted: Thu Jun 13, 2019 1:41 pm
by Per
Strangelove wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 6:45 pm
Strangelove wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 8:29 pm
Strangelove wrote:
Wed Jun 05, 2019 12:31 pm
Per wrote:
Wed Jun 05, 2019 3:10 am
Hopefully the remaining sane republicans in Congress will have the balls to block this idiocy!
Idiocy?

The Donald is merely applying pressure on Mexico.

Patience grasshopper, try to see the big picture...
UPDATE:

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news ... mmigration
Mexican president sends delegation after Trump threatens tariffs over illegal immigration

Mexico’s President Andrés Manuel López Obrador said Thursday that his administration would be sending a delegation to the United States after Trump threatened to impose tariffs on Mexico if they did not stop the influx of illegal immigration.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa- ... T62YC?il=0
Mexico meets migrants at southern border with armed forces

MEXICO CITY (Reuters) - Mexican soldiers, armed police and migration officials blocked hundreds of migrants after they crossed the border from Guatemala in a caravan into southern Mexico on Wednesday, and detained dozens of them, a witness from a migrant aid group and an official said.
Si we cann seniooooor....

UPDATE:

https://www.apnews.com/e18f85f3f23f4fdea76831c80540af15
WASHINGTON (AP) — President Donald Trump says he has suspended plans to impose tariffs on Mexico, tweeting that the country “has agreed to take strong measures” to stem the flow of Central American migrants into the United States.

“I am pleased to inform you that The United States of America has reached a signed agreement with Mexico,” Trump tweeted Friday night, saying the “Tariffs scheduled to be implemented by the U.S. on Monday, against Mexico, are hereby indefinitely suspended.”

He said Mexico has agreed to work to “stem the tide of Migration through Mexico, and to our Southern Border” and said those steps would “greatly reduce, or eliminate, Illegal Immigration coming from Mexico and into the United States.”

He said details would be released soon by the State Department.
YEEEEUP, yup, yup, yup, yup...
Except, it now seems Mexico had agreed to all these things several months ago, long before the tariffs threat Don Corle... er... Trump made.

So basically he threatened with tariffs unless they'd agree to what they had already agreed to... :crazy:

I'm going to let Stephen Colbert do the honours:



Or if you prefer the boring but more traditional factual journalism:
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/08/us/p ... riffs.html

Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Posted: Thu Jun 13, 2019 9:33 pm
by Reefer2
Trump is a magician and his followers lap it up like good doggies.

Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2019 3:45 pm
by Strangelove
Puck wrote:
Fri Jun 14, 2019 12:21 am
Reefer2 wrote:
Thu Jun 13, 2019 9:33 pm
Trump is a magician and his followers lap it up like good doggies.
You’re an idiot, but thanks for your thoughts.
Image