The Absurd and Whimsical Humour of Vladimir "Dobby" Putin

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Re: The Absurd and Whimsical Humour of Vladimir "Dobby" Putin

Post by Per »

Ukranian travel vlogger vlogs about the war:


https://youtu.be/iPsRcW_K-lI
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Re: The Absurd and Whimsical Humour of Vladimir "Dobby" Putin

Post by Meds »

5thhorseman wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 6:56 am
Mëds wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 6:44 am
Per wrote: Thu Apr 21, 2022 11:50 pm
Mëds wrote: Wed Apr 20, 2022 5:51 pm
Per wrote: Tue Apr 19, 2022 7:49 am Looking at the Economist's Democracy Index again, they look at five different criteria and then weigh them into a total score.

According to them, your electoral process is a flawless ten.

Anything above 8 counts as Full Democracy, between 6 and 8 is Flawed Democracy, between 4 and 6 is a Hybrid Regime and below 4 is Authoritarian.

Here are the different categories, the total score and the rank given to Sweden, Canada, the USA, Ukraine and Russia in their last survey:

Democracy Index Categories: - SWE - CAN - USA - UKR - RUS
Electoral process and pluralism 9.58 - 10.00 - 9.17 - 8.25 - 1.75
Functioning of government...... 9.29 - 8.21 - 6.43 - 2.71 - 2.14
Political participation............ 8.33 - 8.89 - 8.89 - 7.22 - 4.44
Political culture.................. 10.00 - 8.13 - 6.25 - 5.00 - 3.75
Civil liberties...................... 9.12 - 9.12 - 8.53 - 5.88 - 4.12
Total score: ..................... 9.26 - 8.87 - 7.85 - 5.57 - 3.24
Rank................................ # 4 - # 12 - # 26 - # 86 - #124

I mean, when you look at those scores, and ponder that Russia has the gall to criticize the legitimacy of the Ukrainian government... :roll:
Just look at the electoral process and pluralism category... I mean, neither country has a properly functioning government, but at least the Ukrainians get to pick theirs. And while their civil liberties can't measure up to those of Canada or Sweden, they are far better respected than in Russia.
I forget though Per, was it Poli-Sci you said you studied when you were living here in Canada way back when?
Never lived in Canada,
Exactly.
That's such a bogus way of shutting out opposing viewpoints Mëds.
It's not about shutting down an opponent.....for one, I don't see Per as an opponent.

The guy doesn't live here, he doesn't experience our "democracy" he just shows up and throws a bunch of stats around and tells us about how we have a say in how our country is governed etc.....west of Ontario we really don't (unless you are a Liberal voter). Even then, you don't have much of a say because the majority of voters don't actually know what they are voting for beyond party name.

And none of us really truly get representation in Ottawa because the vast majority of our MP's don't actually represent their local constituencies, they just vote party line.

Our media is bought and paid for by the Liberal government, which means they control the majority of information that gets disseminated to the public, and they are seeking more control with bills that are disguised as promoting Canadian content first or standing up for free speech and against hate speech.....really they are controlling information and seeking to control more. It's not about transparency, quite the opposite.

Throw all the statistics you want at the wall. He doesn't live here and experience life here, so maybe I just got a little tired of him telling me how things are in my country. Imagine the doctoral thesis we would have to read if we told Per how things were in Sweden.
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Re: The Absurd and Whimsical Humour of Vladimir "Dobby" Putin

Post by Cornuck »

What a shithole! :D
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Re: The Absurd and Whimsical Humour of Vladimir "Dobby" Putin

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Cornuck wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 6:27 pm What a shithole! :D
Sweden?
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Re: The Absurd and Whimsical Humour of Vladimir "Dobby" Putin

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donlever wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 6:43 pm
Cornuck wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 6:27 pm What a shithole! :D
Sweden?
Canada?
Silence intelligence so stupid isn’t offended….
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Re: The Absurd and Whimsical Humour of Vladimir "Dobby" Putin

Post by donlever »

rats19 wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 6:45 pm
donlever wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 6:43 pm
Cornuck wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 6:27 pm What a shithole! :D
Sweden?
Canada?
...oh, he certainly meant to infer Canada.

But the wording at the end of Mëds post allowed for a degree of uncertainty.

So I pounced.

It's what we do here no?
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Re: The Absurd and Whimsical Humour of Vladimir "Dobby" Putin

Post by rats19 »

donlever wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 7:09 pm
rats19 wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 6:45 pm
donlever wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 6:43 pm
Cornuck wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 6:27 pm What a shithole! :D
Sweden?
Canada?
...oh, he certainly meant to infer Canada.

But the wording at the end of Mëds post allowed for a degree of uncertainty.

So I pounced.

It's what we do here no?
Blindingly obvious :thumbs:
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Re: The Absurd and Whimsical Humour of Vladimir "Dobby" Putin

Post by Cornuck »

Yeah - I thought I would throw some sarcasm at the topic. :D

Yes, Canada is not perfect, and no country is - but some (like the one most of you live in) are a fuck of a lot better than others.
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Re: The Absurd and Whimsical Humour of Vladimir "Dobby" Putin

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Cornuck wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 7:17 pm Yeah - I thought I would throw some sarcasm at the topic. :D

Yes, Canada is not perfect, and no country is - but some (like the one most of you live in) are a fuck of a lot better than others.
I would humbly suggest the subject at hand is not truly our freedom(s), pampered existence(s), first world problems, benefit(s) from democracy nor Nationalism/patriotism but rather one of sanctimony, be it perceived or otherwise.
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Re: The Absurd and Whimsical Humour of Vladimir "Dobby" Putin

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I’ve stated several times that I do not feel comfortable discussing Canadian politics as I know far too little about it.

But when I suggest that Russia is a shithole human rights disaster and a brutal dictatorship that poses a threat to its neighbours, and someone (I shall name no names) suggests that ”yeah, well, Canada is just as bad”, I take offense.

As little as I know, I still know enough to feel confident in stating that this is simply not true.

And if any Canadian is offended by my refusal to believe that Canada is just as shitty as Russia, then so be it.
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Re: The Absurd and Whimsical Humour of Vladimir "Dobby" Putin

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Just an example….

A curious number of Russian oligarchs have mysteriously died since the invasion began.


https://youtu.be/tkZOTXt1Uhg
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Re: The Absurd and Whimsical Humour of Vladimir "Dobby" Putin

Post by Per »

Former Finnish PM Alexander Stubb on a possible future Nato membership.


https://youtu.be/ITsMBjIprGk

1340 km of land border with Russia. Gives a certain perspective to things… :hmmm:
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Re: The Absurd and Whimsical Humour of Vladimir "Dobby" Putin

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Per wrote: Sat Apr 23, 2022 4:45 am But when I suggest that Russia is a shithole human rights disaster and a brutal dictatorship that poses a threat to its neighbours, and someone (I shall name no names) suggests that ”yeah, well, Canada is just as bad", I take offense.
...did Mëds say this though Per? (I have no problem naming names, we're all big boys here).

I believe the divergence of opinion is often based on an outsiders belief of what our political system offers Canadian citizens versus the reality of our existence within the confines of said apparatus.

I think in some posts on the subject you may have proffered what is clearly an educated, Political Science based theory to posit your opinion regarding the structure or methodologies behind our political vehicles which, in a microcosm, makes sense or may breed factualites in an "it says so in the textbooks" manner, whereby in the realities of our Countries Governmental process it perhaps does not.

I believe it to be clear to all, for whatever his reasons, Mëds has extremely strong opinions on this subject thus the manner in which you addressed the matter to him resulted in his taking offense to studied, as opposed to in actuality, scenarios.

Look, donlever is a live and let live dude. The Canadian political process is what it is and there is less than zero I can do about it.

I am happy as hell to have been born here and reside where I do and am thrilled to take advantage of the life opportunities, both financial and personal freedom based, which Canada provides.

I take it as it comes and roll with it.

Others get more vehement about it.

Mëds is one of those guys.

I'm pretty sure we can talk it out civilly and agree to disagree however.

Most of us have been around a long time in these parts and we're all structured by our own personal beliefs thus agreeing to disagree should be second nature by now.
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Re: The Absurd and Whimsical Humour of Vladimir "Dobby" Putin

Post by Meds »

Per wrote: Sat Apr 23, 2022 4:45 am I’ve stated several times that I do not feel comfortable discussing Canadian politics as I know far too little about it.
And yet you always seem to do just that.....
Per wrote: But when I suggest that Russia is a shithole human rights disaster and a brutal dictatorship that poses a threat to its neighbours, and someone (I shall name no names) suggests that ”yeah, well, Canada is just as bad”, I take offense.
Nice use of quotations to quote......
Per wrote:
Mëds wrote: Timofey Sergeytsev is proposing a final solution of the Ukraine problem: :crazy:

https://theconversation.com/manifesto-p ... ine-181006

:o
And our Liberal government wants to get their own claws on control of media here in Canada. But yeah, we're a stable democracy.....
I see nothing in there saying that Canada is currently a brutal dictatorship that poses a threat to its neighbours. I see here a comment replying to the portion of that article that speaks to the government seizure and censorship of privately funded (aka not a government mouthpiece) media agencies.

Since you're such a history buff Per, what is one of the primary things that every dictatorship, fascist, authoritarian, state does? They control the information that is disseminated to their citizens. They censor opposing views. They limit access to information. They reject transparency. It's what Russia has, and is again (if they ever stopped), doing right now. It is what Nazi Germany did. It is what Mussolini's Italy did. It is what China does. Control the information.

So when our democratically elected government is trying to pass laws and make policies that will put us on a pathway to that style of government control and censorship of information (which becomes a censorship of opinion and free speech), and they form a coalition (in all but name) so that there can be no opposition to this for the next 3 years, I'd say that freedoms are in jeopardy. I'd say that said government will then use that media that they control to spread disinformation leading up to the next election and to skew the public opinion and to mislead the public. Media assimilation. They already do this via the CBC on a regular basis, and to a lesser extent through CTV and Global. Read some of the comments coming out of those media outlets regarding the Conservative leadership race, calling Pierre Poiliever a racist populist. Twisting things he says, or outright lying (or repeating the lies spoken by Mr. Trudeau and/or his government) about the man's past and things he says.
As little as I know, I still know enough to feel confident in stating that this is simply not true.

And if any Canadian is offended by my refusal to believe that Canada is just as shitty as Russia, then so be it.
I'm not offended that you don't believe we're as shitty as Russia. I don't believe we are. I think we could head that way though with the laws and policies of our current Liberal government that wants to get their own claws on control of media here in Canada. Which doesn't bode well for a stable democracy that seeks to embrace the views and freedoms of all of it's citizens.

And for the record, I think it would be equally disastrous for that law to be passed and then a Conservative government somehow be elected into power and opt to utilize said laws for their own benefit rather than repeal them.

Echo chambers are dangerous places. It's what makes this here hockey talk message board such a great place, we have alternate views.

Edit: Oh, and what lever said too. Quite on point, though more eloquently put than I could have communicated it myself.
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Re: The Absurd and Whimsical Humour of Vladimir "Dobby" Putin

Post by Meds »

donlever wrote: Sat Apr 23, 2022 10:18 am
Per wrote: Sat Apr 23, 2022 4:45 am But when I suggest that Russia is a shithole human rights disaster and a brutal dictatorship that poses a threat to its neighbours, and someone (I shall name no names) suggests that ”yeah, well, Canada is just as bad", I take offense.
...did Mëds say this though Per? (I have no problem naming names, we're all big boys here).

I believe the divergence of opinion is often based on an outsiders belief of what our political system offers Canadian citizens versus the reality of our existence within the confines of said apparatus.

I think in some posts on the subject you may have proffered what is clearly an educated, Political Science based theory to posit your opinion regarding the structure or methodologies behind our political vehicles which, in a microcosm, makes sense or may breed factualites in an "it says so in the textbooks" manner, whereby in the realities of our Countries Governmental process it perhaps does not.
Donny, I believe you hit the nail on the head. I would suggest that in my case my irritation with this sort of thing is borne of the job that I do. You go through 4 years of training and education, being taught and told what to do and not to do in regards to safety and proper procedures etc. The indication/contraindication sort of stuff. Well you very quickly realize that textbooks and talking heads don't always translate to real world situations, and if you go by the book you likely be unable to accomplish your ends via the means outlined in the "rulebook".....and failing to accomplish the ends would mean leaving someone up shit creek, or worse. So one quickly learns that textbooks are more of a guide and experience gives you the tools to understand when the guidelines are and are not applied.
Look, donlever is a live and let live dude. The Canadian political process is what it is and there is less than zero I can do about it.

I am happy as hell to have been born here and reside where I do and am thrilled to take advantage of the life opportunities, both financial and personal freedom based, which Canada provides.
I'm also someone who advocates for the live and let live.

I also share similar views to you regarding our political process.....I just bitch about it (alot) more.

I am happy to have been born where I was born, though I suppose the changes I have seen over the last decade (in particular the last 7-8 years) erode that happiness and feed my vehemence, in particular the last 2+ years where I have seen our government use language and craft policy that directly opposes the live and let live mentality.....though they attempt to cloak these policies under the very guise of tolerance and acceptance.

On the financial side of things, I also see them trying their damnedest to restrict freedoms and opportunity wherever they can.

So yeah.

I have some vehemence going on. :lol:
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