Israeli–Palestinian conflict

[Topper]

I wish my forefathers did the same with the pilgrims.

So do I.

The ensuing bloodbath of gun powder vs the stone age would have solved many of todays problems.

[Strangelove]

It's not muslim fundamentalism that's the cause

Israel will not have peace like this

Israel has never had the option of peace.

Is it so wrong to blame "muslim fundamentalism"?

[SKYO]

I wish my forefathers did the same with the pilgrims.

So do I.

The ensuing bloodbath of gun powder vs the stone age would have solved many of todays problems.

Yeah those 20 pound matchlock muskets that didn't work and were so shitty that even crossbows and winter could have wiped out all those foreign euro wetbacks...in any case the natives did the regrettably helpful thing and gave the pilgrims food, taught them to hunt and survive the deadly eastern winters.

anyways..

[rats19]

I wish my forefathers did the same with the pilgrims.

So do I.

The ensuing bloodbath of gun powder vs the stone age would have solved many of todays problems.

Yeah those 20 pound matchlock muskets that didn't work and were so shitty that even crossbows and winter could have wiped out all those foreign euro wetbacks...in any case the natives did the regrettably helpful thing and gave the pilgrims food, taught them to hunt and survive the deadly eastern winters.

anyways..

The world had to expand and make room skyo...inevitable really and nothing anyone could have done about it...you had it pretty swell for 10,000 years or so....good run

[SKYO]

LoL I'm not trying to hate, rats, just defending.

[rats19]

LoL I'm not trying to hate, rats, just defending.

Don't let it get to ya skyo.....there was nothing anyone could have done....mars is next, just ain't no stopping us....lol

[Meds]

Palestinians aren't fighting for their home as well?
Have you not been paying attention to the prison camp the Israelis are operating in Gaza?
These people are trapped in a cage with no hope of escape, there is no airport, no land crossings out and no sea port not controlled by the Israelis.
(Even if they do escape the can get no passport as they are stateless....)

No food gets in, no medical supplies and no construction materials without their say so.

They control the amount of food Palestinians are allowed by the calorie per person...
Isreal has a right to exist and the right to defend themselves but they are creating this mess and then cry foul when the Palestinians, whose backs are against the wall, fire shitty little rockets they manage to smuggle in and suicide bomb wherever they can.

It's insane

Imagine if they started smuggling in food instead of rockets.....



Of course, ukcanuck would probably support ISIS's right to exist in North America.

[Meds]

I wish my forefathers did the same with the pilgrims.

So do I.

The ensuing bloodbath of gun powder vs the stone age would have solved many of todays problems.

Yeah those 20 pound matchlock muskets that didn't work and were so shitty that even crossbows and winter could have wiped out all those foreign euro wetbacks...in any case the natives did the regrettably helpful thing and gave the pilgrims food, taught them to hunt and survive the deadly eastern winters.

anyways..

Yeah. That's how it went down.....

All they could have done by "wiping out all those foreign euro wetbacks" would have been to forestall the inevitable.

No matter what theory you subscribe to the indigenous folk of North America had been here for thousands of years by the time "the white man" showed up. The technology gap was incredible. So if they had done some hooting and hollering and painted their faces and chased those pilgrims out, Europe would have just come back later. Better armed, and ready to kick some ass. The result would have been the same.....probably worse for the Native Americans as instead of having some Europeans want to play nice with Tonto, they all would have shot first and asked questions later. Reserves? No. Mass graves. Trading posts? No. Concentration camps (at best). Treaties? No. Surrenders and subjugation.

Fast forward to today.

Those who survived would be 100% contributing citizens.....not a drain on our resources or an obstacle to economic improvement.

He may be overly blunt.....but if Topper ever ran for office I would seriously have to consider voting for him.

[ukcanuck]

I wish my forefathers did the same with the pilgrims.

So do I.

The ensuing bloodbath of gun powder vs the stone age would have solved many of todays problems.

Yeah those 20 pound matchlock muskets that didn't work and were so shitty that even crossbows and winter could have wiped out all those foreign euro wetbacks...in any case the natives did the regrettably helpful thing and gave the pilgrims food, taught them to hunt and survive the deadly eastern winters.

anyways..

Yeah. That's how it went down.....

All they could have done by "wiping out all those foreign euro wetbacks" would have been to forestall the inevitable.

No matter what theory you subscribe to the indigenous folk of North America had been here for thousands of years by the time "the white man" showed up. The technology gap was incredible. So if they had done some hooting and hollering and painted their faces and chased those pilgrims out, Europe would have just come back later. Better armed, and ready to kick some ass. The result would have been the same.....probably worse for the Native Americans as instead of having some Europeans want to play nice with Tonto, they all would have shot first and asked questions later. Reserves? No. Mass graves. Trading posts? No. Concentration camps (at best). Treaties? No. Surrenders and subjugation.

Fast forward to today.

Those who survived would be 100% contributing citizens.....not a drain on our resources or an obstacle to economic improvement.

He may be overly blunt.....but if Topper ever ran for office I would seriously have to consider voting for him.

So you you're saying you voted for ol stevo Harper ?

Neo con ambulance drivers unite!

No more drags on society! No more drag queens too!

Concentration camps R us

[ukcanuck]

Palestinians aren't fighting for their home as well?
Have you not been paying attention to the prison camp the Israelis are operating in Gaza?
These people are trapped in a cage with no hope of escape, there is no airport, no land crossings out and no sea port not controlled by the Israelis.
(Even if they do escape the can get no passport as they are stateless....)

No food gets in, no medical supplies and no construction materials without their say so.

They control the amount of food Palestinians are allowed by the calorie per person...
Isreal has a right to exist and the right to defend themselves but they are creating this mess and then cry foul when the Palestinians, whose backs are against the wall, fire shitty little rockets they manage to smuggle in and suicide bomb wherever they can.

It's insane

Imagine if they started smuggling in food instead of rockets.....



Of course, ukcanuck would probably support ISIS's right to exist in North America.

Yo Mëds wake up,
ISis is in another country and is a different argument.
Get your facts straight .V.
Palestine and what those people are going through is an humanitarian issue now.
I wonder what you would do, if you only knew how to put the shoe on the other foot?

[herb]

No matter what theory you subscribe to the indigenous folk of North America had been here for thousands of years by the time "the white man" showed up. The technology gap was incredible. So if they had done some hooting and hollering and painted their faces and chased those pilgrims out, Europe would have just come back later. Better armed, and ready to kick some ass. The result would have been the same.....probably worse for the Native Americans as instead of having some Europeans want to play nice with Tonto, they all would have shot first and asked questions later. Reserves? No. Mass graves. Trading posts? No. Concentration camps (at best). Treaties? No. Surrenders and subjugation.

They might have ended up like the indigenous people who were unfortunate enough to meet the Spanish (i.e. they don't exist anymore).

[SKYO]

Those who survived would be 100% contributing citizens.....not a drain on our resources or an obstacle to economic improvement.

Whats done is done, there were wars for centuries, but as everyone knows eventually the yankees/british won and sent every kid from 4 years old to residential schools to forcefully assimilate them/colonization.

And in those residential schools there were a lot of beatings and rapes where many kids died and were buried before anyone found out.

All the Indians were forced onto mostly crappy reserves with shitty farm land, and through racism were not allowed to grow their businesses, there were many good entrepeneurs back then, but some how they all got shutdown one way or the other.

Even a few generations ago the Indians were not allowed to leave the reserves without a pass.

But anyways Mëds, the First Nation people are still learning and growing as a whole and the bigger bands are doing some great economic work lately, helping to create jobs like the Tsawwassen mega malls, and just recently the huge Jericho deal, where after consultation with everyone it will eventually lead to another mega development/construction jobs and future homes to many families. It's the small isolated bands in the middle of nowhere, with nothing to work with, on shitty land that are struggling alot.

[Meds]

Those who survived would be 100% contributing citizens.....not a drain on our resources or an obstacle to economic improvement.

Whats done is done, there were wars for centuries, but as everyone knows eventually the yankees/british won and sent every kid from 4 years old to residential schools to forcefully assimilate them/colonization.

And in those residential schools there were a lot of beatings and rapes where many kids died and were buried before anyone found out.

All the Indians were forced onto mostly crappy reserves with shitty farm land, and through racism were not allowed to grow their businesses, there were many good entrepeneurs back then, but some how they all got shutdown one way or the other.

Even a few generations ago the Indians were not allowed to leave the reserves without a pass.

Yeah, I'm well aware. And frankly it's all bullshit.....I mean bullshit that it was handled that way, not bullshit as in it didn't happen.

I fully agree with you, what's done is done, move on. Unfortunately, too many won't move on. They can't leave the past behind, and they still want to be paid some bereavement pay for things that happened to a different generation.

But anyways Mëds, the First Nation people are still learning and growing as a whole and the bigger bands are doing some great economic work lately, helping to create jobs like the Tsawwassen mega malls, and just recently the huge Jericho deal, where after consultation with everyone it will eventually lead to another mega development/construction jobs and future homes to many families. It's the small isolated bands in the middle of nowhere, with nothing to work with, on shitty land that are struggling alot.

And I'm all for it man, I'm just not for the go aheads and perks that they get to make it happen. I think that every First Nation individual should have the same rights and freedoms and opportunities that every other Canadian citizen has. They should NOT get more. They have done nothing to earn more, and quite often they squander the more that they are given. I have seen plenty of friends put out of work because a First Nations company comes in and takes the contract. Not because they do a better job, often they perform worse, not because they under-bid, often they bid a bit higher. They get it just because they are First Nation, and apparently "it's their land".

I have no use for anyone who wants to benefit from all of the resources of Canada, but doesn't want share it with the rest of the nation.

[SKYO]

yeah...I need a break from this aha

[Meds]

Yeah, I'm well aware. And frankly it's all bullshit.....I mean bullshit that it was handled that way, not bullshit as in it didn't happen.

I fully agree with you, what's done is done, move on. Unfortunately, too many won't move on. They can't leave the past behind, and they still want to be paid some bereavement pay for things that happened to a different generation.

LOL 'it's all bullshit, but not bullshit wtf are you going on about.

Who is 'THEY' want to still be paid for bereavement.

English isn't your strong suit is it.....

The residential schools, all of that. What a bullshit thing to do.

And 'THEY' are the first nations people today. They always expect to be given everything. Not all of them, but the majority of the ones that I encounter are always expecting things to just be given to them. Like it is their right to be given free money from the government. Free education. A house. Etc.

Then they expect that jobs should just be handed to them, and if they don't have the skills or training to do the job, then they should be given that training and education.....at no cost to themselves.

And I'm all for it man, I'm just not for the go aheads and perks that they get to make it happen.

I think that every First Nation individual should have the same rights and freedoms and opportunities that every other Canadian citizen has.

They should NOT get more.

exactly who has go aheads and perks?

LOL did you see our history??? hell no did any first nation have any pull in their business with white folks.

lmaoooooooo no way in hell did First Nations ever get more rights and freedoms in the past to succeed...somehow, someway there was a law to stop it.

Who has perks? Are you kidding? Talk to some of the employees up here who get laid off and replaced with First Nation workers. Some of them even brag about the fact that they can't get fired because if they do the band will raise hell to shutdown the project. What about the fact that if you can prove you are little as 1/8th (might be less) First Nations you will get your post-secondary education paid for by the government. That's not a perk? How about the lump sum of money many of them get when they turn 18 (or is it 16?)? Not a perk? How about not having to pay taxes but still enjoying ALL of the benefits of a taxpayer funded system? I guess that's not a perk either. Companies that are not owned by First Nations often get preferential treatment when it comes to government approvals if they have a partnership with a First Nation band, and they pay through the nose to get that partnership. Some companies can't even get project approval without First Nation partnerships.

Your history? Who the hell is talking about ancient history. I'm talking about now. What's done is done. Move on. Remember? I'm not disputing the bullshit way in which things were handled in the past, I'm talking about the present.

Again, with the past. Rights and freedoms? In the past no, but now? Now they just do whatever the hell they please, and when they get called up on the carpet by the law they cry racism and get a bunch of people worked up. They get first crack at so many more employment opportunities, the only saving grace for most of us is that a lot of them are too lazy to take them. They get the education (previously mentioned). They get first rights to a ton of natural resources. They don't need a hunting or fishing license, just their status card. They make the biggest noise about "mother nature" but are probably the worst polluters in the country.....but everyone has to stop and go the extra environmental mile because of the noise they make.

They have plenty of rights and freedoms that others don't.

They have done nothing to earn more, and quite often they squander the more that they are given. I have seen plenty of friends put out of work because a First Nations company comes in and takes the contract. Not because they do a better job, often they perform worse, not because they under-bid, often they bid a bit higher. They get it just because they are First Nation, and apparently "it's their land".

I think this is pivotal point where Mëds gets his racist/hatred point of view.

Get off the meth dude.

It's not racism or hatred bud. It's more disappointment in a government that caters to a community of people who are made up of a disproportional share of freeloaders. It doesn't matter to me what colour their skin is, what language they speak, or what religion they follow, just treat people the same no matter what.