Farhan's $0.02 - Here is who the Canucks need to trade

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Farhan Lalji

Farhan's $0.02 - Here is who the Canucks need to trade

Post by Farhan Lalji » Sun Jan 09, 2011 2:43 pm

Farhan's $0.02 - Here is who the Canucks need to trade

Absolutely no one. :)

Salo: In my opinion, the Canucks should just keep everything as is. I wouldn't tweak a single thing right now....and that includes keeping Bieksa. I'm not sure what the roster ramifications will be when Salo gets back, but I'm thinking that maybe even HE shouldn't crack the line up. Being on the wrong side of 30 (unlike me....who is on the RIGHT side of 30 ;) ), and not having played a game since last year's playoffs, I don't think Salo would be an upgrade over Bieksa. Hell - would a "rusty and aging" Salo be an upgrade over Alberts?

Raymond: I haven't been paying too much attention to the line combo's as of late, but where is Raymond playing? Is he playing alongside Kesler and Tambellini? If NOT (i.e. if Hansen is playing on that 2nd line), then I would encourage things to stay that way. If Raymond is already playing there however, then keep things that way.

Hodgson: At some point, do you think the Canucks should call up Hodgson? On the one hand, he could help greatly. On the other hand, why spoil the chemistry?

I will say ONE thing however: Is anyone else, besides me, a little CONCERNED about the Canucks' winning record right now? I know that sounds like an odd thing to say, but I shudder to think about what the media will be like if the Canucks are the #1 team in the NHL when the season ends.

Unfortunately, Vancouver is NOT like the city of Pitsburgh, Chicago, Tampa Bay, Anaheim, or Detroit. Unlike the aforementioned cities, Vancouver has NOT won a championship at any major sport....and hockey just so happens to be the only sport that we really care about. The media pressure will be extremely intense...and anything short of a Stanley Cup victory could be seen as a massive choke job unfortunately.

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Re: Farhan's $0.02 - Here is who the Canucks need to trade

Post by Cornuck » Sun Jan 09, 2011 2:47 pm

Farhan Lalji wrote:...anything short of a Stanley Cup victory could be seen as a massive choke job unfortunately.
That's already the case no matter where they end up in the standings this year.

I trust that Gillis and AV will make Salo's transition into the lineup as smooth as possible if we are still winning consistently. If we're in the middle of a losing streak when Salo is ready, then lineup juggling won't be an issue.

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Re: Farhan's $0.02 - Here is who the Canucks need to trade

Post by Farhan Lalji » Sun Jan 09, 2011 3:43 pm

Cornuck wrote:
Farhan Lalji wrote:...anything short of a Stanley Cup victory could be seen as a massive choke job unfortunately.
That's already the case no matter where they end up in the standings this year.

I trust that Gillis and AV will make Salo's transition into the lineup as smooth as possible if we are still winning consistently. If we're in the middle of a losing streak when Salo is ready, then lineup juggling won't be an issue.

Trust in GMMG
Agree and Disagree.

I agree with you that heading into this season, anything short of a cup victory would have been considered "disappointing." However - I think a 3rd round loss would have been seen as 'respectable'...or an improvement. While I still do hold that mentality, I'm a little concerned that the media here won't see it that way...and that's unfortunate.

While it's good to be driven to the be the best, I'm just not sure if I'm going to like this inevitable "all or bust" mentality that the media will most certainly create.

Perhaps there is a reason why teams like Ottawa and San Jose never won cups during their respective primes.....maybe the pressure was just too much. In cities like Pitsburgh, Tampa Bay, Carolina, Anaheim, Chicago, or Detroit...where the cities had already experienced victory in a major sport...or flat out didn't give a shit about hockey, the pressure simply isn't/wasn't the same...as it will be here.

The point I'm trying to make is this: The Canucks better be ready for what's coming. For better or for worse, it doesn't matter if the Canucks finish 20 games over .500 or 45 games over .500. The vindictive Vancouver media will NOT be kind if the Canucks do NOT win a cup this year.

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Re: Farhan's $0.02 - Here is who the Canucks need to trade

Post by Tiger » Sun Jan 09, 2011 3:46 pm

Unless there are injuries I doubt we will see Hodgson this year.. He would be wasted if he had to play on the 4th line and seems a bit fragile for that role.. We are overloaded with NHL wingers at this time and as his natural position is center I can see no reason for bringing him up.. He isn't going to repace Maholtra , Kesler or Sedin.

If Salo is in game shape ( probably needing a conditioning stint in Wpg and a few games before he is ).. He is still the #1 2way dman on the roster..
Being on the wrong side of 30 (unlike me....who is on the RIGHT side of 30 ), and not having played a game since last year's playoffs, I don't think Salo would be an upgrade over Bieksa. Hell - would a "rusty and aging" Salo be an upgrade over Alberts?
As usual you got it wrong Farhan.. or maybe your memory just is impaired? Remember when Ohlund and Linden ( both on the RIGHT SIDE ( over ) 30 ) :lol: were our 2 top playoff players? Please remember " Age and craftiness beats youth and enthusiasm every time ) = Lidstrom , Pronger Ohlund etc..
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Re: Farhan's $0.02 - Here is who the Canucks need to trade

Post by Farhan Lalji » Sun Jan 09, 2011 5:53 pm

Tiger wrote:
As usual you got it wrong Farhan.. or maybe your memory just is impaired? Remember when Ohlund and Linden ( both on the RIGHT SIDE ( over ) 30 ) :lol: were our 2 top playoff players? Please remember " Age and craftiness beats youth and enthusiasm every time ) = Lidstrom , Pronger Ohlund etc..
Uhhhh....thanks, and nice class there buddy. :look:

Linden and Ohlund played well for us in the playoffs (I think you are referring to the 06/07 season), but they weren't coming off any significant injuries....or layoffs. Unfortunately for Salo, he fits into both categories....and he's not Mats Sundin.

Your references to Lidstrom and Pronger are also irrelevant since
1) Salo is not of that calibre
2) I do not seem to recall Lidstrom and Pronger missing a large majority of the season in the manner that Salo has (after the age of 34/35).

Fine - after a conditioning stint - yes, slowly inject Salo into the line-up. Maybe I was a bit overzealous when I claimed that he shouldn't even replace Alberts. However - at this point...or even at any point in the season, I don't see him being better than Bieksa...or anyone comparable.

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Re: Farhan's $0.02 - Here is who the Canucks need to trade

Post by Farhan Lalji » Sun Jan 09, 2011 6:03 pm

Tiger wrote:
If Salo is in game shape ( probably needing a conditioning stint in Wpg and a few games before he is ).. He is still the #1 2way dman on the roster..
One more comment:

Do you remember the year after the Ducks won the cup, Scott Niedermayer didn't start playing until half way through the season...or even longer than that?

Niedermayer wasn't able to play quite up to his usual level and even commented as such after the season (i.e. how difficult it is to play, in mid-season form, after such a long layoff). As recently as two years ago, we saw the same thing with Mats Sundin. In Sundin's case, it wasn't until the playoffs where he started to show traces of his old self (he was PPG player in that post-season). I'm not sure what your definition of "game shape" is, but it's going to take a heck of a lot longer than "a few games" for Salo to get back to his usual level.

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Re: Farhan's $0.02 - Here is who the Canucks need to trade

Post by jchockey » Sun Jan 09, 2011 7:00 pm

So how do we get Salo in the lineup then? Unless you're suggesting that we keep Salo on the IR, which I imagine would undoubtedly piss him off. Salo's been participating in full practices already.

Tamby and Hansen split 2nd line duties, depending on how the game goes.

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Re: Farhan's $0.02 - Here is who the Canucks need to trade

Post by Tiger » Sun Jan 09, 2011 7:08 pm

I'm not sure what your definition of "game shape" is, but it's going to take a heck of a lot longer than "a few games" for Salo to get back to his usual level.
IF he returns ( and its an if ) he is eligible to be sent to the Moose for " conditioning ".. meaning 10 days plus if the league gives permission an extra 4 days in the Moose pasture.. Then a " few games" with the Canucks before I expect him to play at an NHL level.. Agree just a " few games " wont be enough to get 100% from Sami.. But Moose time + a few games will probably bring him back to 90%.. which is still better than most of our Dmen :) No need to give him top minutes or put him back to our top 4 until he earns the time . But it gives us another good point man for the PP and a solid penalty killer .

PS the difference between an aging Sundin ( who "retired" and did very little conditioning until after his midseason decision to play for the Nucks) and Salo is that Salo did all he could to stay in shape during his injury and is skating and practicing NOW
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Re: Farhan's $0.02 - Here is who the Canucks need to trade

Post by Tiger » Sun Jan 09, 2011 7:17 pm

I don't see him being better than Bieksa...or anyone comparable.
hmmm did you watch Bieksa cough up the puck in OT last night against Detroit? TWICE !! A case of nerves maybe ? which you don't get from older players.. This has been Bieksa's best season and he is doing a great job but still has the odd hiccup .. More experience = Less hiccups = Salo :). Though Jchockey brings up a valid point .. we need cap room to bring Salo back so who goes?
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Re: Farhan's $0.02 - Here is who the Canucks need to trade

Post by Island Nucklehead » Sun Jan 09, 2011 10:51 pm

Bieksa is playing for the best team in hockey, helping them be the best team in hockey. Salo isn't.

I don't know if anyone notices anything but the mistakes (and the one in OT was bad), but Bieksa has been arguably our best defenceman on this current streak. That's saying something. I'm sure we can all remember when he had 3 points on the season, all in one game. He now has 5 goals, and 15 points and is +16 (tied 2nd on the team with the Sedins, one behind Kesler). He's taking on the opponents top lines, and him and Hamhuis are our number 1 pairing.

Anyone thinking of trading Bieksa at this point needs a head-check. Especially when you want to replace him with an aging, brittle, soft, Salo.

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Re: Farhan's $0.02 - Here is who the Canucks need to trade

Post by dr.dork » Sun Jan 09, 2011 11:41 pm

Island Nucklehead wrote: Anyone thinking of trading Bieksa at this point needs a head-check. Especially when you want to replace him with an aging, brittle, soft, Salo.
Farhan's starts a new thread to rehash the other thread wrt what to do when Salo returns. And in Farhan fashion he tries to distill a complex situation into a simple one.

I have no complaints about Bieksa lately. He makes mistakes but he makes right decisions offensively too.

When Salo is ready to return, we have a complicated decision to make based on his play, the play of the rest of the D, the team, and the injury (and cap) situation. It isn't a simple 2 cents formula.

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Re: Farhan's $0.02 - Here is who the Canucks need to trade

Post by ClamRussel » Mon Jan 10, 2011 2:18 am

Tiger wrote:Unless there are injuries I doubt we will see Hodgson this year.. He would be wasted if he had to play on the 4th line and seems a bit fragile for that role..
Beg to differ, not saying he's prototypical 4th line material but, his injuries would have happened to anyone. The facial injury is a bit of a fluke...back injury working out....back injury from been hit from behind into the boards....puck off the foot. If anything I see him as a bit snakebitten but fragile never entered my mind. These things happen.
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Re: Farhan's $0.02 - Here is who the Canucks need to trade

Post by Tiger » Mon Jan 10, 2011 5:44 am

Island Nucklehead wrote:Bieksa is playing for the best team in hockey, helping them be the best team in hockey. Salo isn't.

I don't know if anyone notices anything but the mistakes (and the one in OT was bad), but Bieksa has been arguably our best defenceman on this current streak. That's saying something. I'm sure we can all remember when he had 3 points on the season, all in one game. He now has 5 goals, and 15 points and is +16 (tied 2nd on the team with the Sedins, one behind Kesler). He's taking on the opponents top lines, and him and Hamhuis are our number 1 pairing.

Anyone thinking of trading Bieksa at this point needs a head-check. Especially when you want to replace him with an aging, brittle, soft, Salo.
Agree !! but then nobody on this thread suggested trading Bieksa..! I would suggest that Hamhuis is the best Dman on the squad... as he makes Bieksa better.. same as Mitchell did in the past .. Your suggestion that Salo is aging ( damm it I am too :) ) is valid... Brittle or just snake bit and accident prone.. Soft ? No Way ..
The problem is if Canucks management, coaches and trainers determine he is in good shape and able to contribute he comes off IR and we have the problem of the dammed cap to contend with. So the real question is WHO goes? no brainer is Rome but that isn't enough for cap relief .. maybe add a forward like Samuelsson and get back good future assets? MG is the guy that is going to have to figure this one out.. A bit much for us fans !! Be quite a formidable D squad if we can keep the top 5 and add Salo .. keeping Alberts on over Rome .. he hits harder !
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Re: Farhan's $0.02 - Here is who the Canucks need to trade

Post by the toucan kid » Mon Jan 10, 2011 11:54 am

Island, I'm not knocking Bieksa, but he's not even close to our best D-man right now.

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Re: Farhan's $0.02 - Here is who the Canucks need to trade

Post by Island Nucklehead » Mon Jan 10, 2011 12:35 pm

the toucan kid wrote:Island, I'm not knocking Bieksa, but he's not even close to our best D-man right now.
Right now... it would seem that he is. To say he's not even close is ridiculous.

Since our last regulation loss (17 games): 4G, 7A, 11pts +14. 2 of his goals were game winners.

Edler is 2G, 6A, 8Pts, +3.
Ehrhoff is 2G, 9A, 11pts +2.
Hamhuis has 6A, +9.
Ballard 1G, 2A, + 7.

Sure seems to me like Bieksa IS our best defenceman at the moment. Him and Hamhuis are playing against the top lines and are the top PK minute men. IT should also be noted that Bieksa is getting nearly 1min/game less on the PP than Edler and Ehrhoff. Bieksa leads the D in 5-on-5 scoring.

Obviously having Hamhuis as a partner is allowing Bieksa to play with a more liberal mindset, but he hasn't been awful in his own zone, he's battling hard (him vs Holmstrom was like a playoff war) and he's putting up points.

GMMG should be seriously considering all options to keep Bieksa on this roster. Even if we lose him as a UFA, he's more valuable right now than the monster of a question mark that is Salo.

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