WHERE do the Canucks go from here? List your strategies

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Lancer
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Re: WHERE do the Canucks go from here? List your strategies

Post by Lancer » Sat May 15, 2010 2:56 pm

orts wrote:Speaking of which, I was listening to Pratt yesterday and he would love to see Shea Weber here. duh...yeah right. According to Dave, offer a first-round pick and say..Mason Raymond and you've got a deal because Nashville are cash-strapped and would be looking to unload big contracts. I must have missed the memo. Since when are other teams lining up to make sweetheart deals with the Canucks for their best players?
I kinda rolled my eyes when I read that. Who in their right mind would let Weber go for MayRay and the 25th overall in this year's draft?

That said, I think Nashville is a logical trading partner, for one of a couple of assets - Weber (it would have to be a blockbuster with maybe core folks going the other way, or it's the swindle of the decade), Hamhuis (even if only for exclusive negotiating rights), and/or somebody like Cody Franson (6'5", 220lbs, young and has offensive upside... what's not to like???). Nashville has an embarrassment of blueline rishes and needs offense. Vancouver has the 2nd-ranked offense and needs a defenceman or two.

What about a scenario that has Franson (for reasons explained above) and Radulov (I think both Radulov and Nashville would be pleased to part ways and save face) go to Vancouver for Raymond, Vancouver's 1st round this year and Shirokov. MG may have to throw in Schneider perhaps, but it's not a bad option - especially if you want to flip Radulov (if you think Grabner can do what Raymond has done) for another defenceman. Hamhuis would be a good FA signing as well, but anybody else on Nashville's blueline (ie-Weber and Suter) and it will take more than what I think Gillis is ready to spend.

Thoughts?
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Re: WHERE do the Canucks go from here? List your strategies

Post by Farhan Lalji » Sat May 15, 2010 3:42 pm

Lancer wrote: Thoughts?
Yeah, I definitely like your way of thinking here.

Like you said - Nashville has an embarrassment of riches on defense while the Canucks have a lot of skilled forwards up front.

I still can't see Nashville trading Weber, but I'd be willing to do almost anything to get him (i.e. trade anyone outside of the twins, Luongo, and Kesler).

Farhan Lalji

Re: WHERE do the Canucks go from here? List your strategies

Post by Farhan Lalji » Sat May 15, 2010 3:44 pm

Sid Dithers wrote:
Farhan Lalji wrote: My guess would be the following:

-Hodgson (for a very promising defensive prospect)
No. I don't trade away blue chippers until I see what they can do at the NHL level.
Farhan Lalji wrote:Schroeder and Schneider (for a very promising defensive prospect))
Might work. I'm still skeptical about Schroeder's realistic potential.
Farhan Lalji wrote:Bieksa (for a solid power forward)
Wouldn't fetch that much. The bloom is off that rose. But you MIGHT get a project power forward prospect.
Farhan Lalji wrote:Samuelson (for a legitimate top tier shut down center that would also be a top notch PK guy)
No. If you start trading away FA's who chose to sign here, you'll never attract them anymore if you treat one bad.
Good post Sid....especially that last point. Not sure what else to say here other than I agree what you're saying. 8-)

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Re: WHERE do the Canucks go from here? List your strategies

Post by ClamRussel » Sat May 15, 2010 6:36 pm

rockalt wrote:On that same note, I'm a little irritated with the Luongo got outplayed by Niemi schtick. I get that it's very easy to say given the stats and outcome, but don't kid yourselves, the Canucks were completely outchanced and outclassed in this series. They didn't generate anywhere near the same number of quality scoring chances that the Hawks did. When they did apply pressure on Niemi, he was very average. Switch the goalies' teams and he would have been lit up, I have no doubt about that.

Look I get that Luongo was sub-par (great games coupled with some real stinkers) but Niemi was no better. Difference is, he didn't need to be.
Couldn't agree with you more. Anyone who knows anything about goaltending could see Niemi fought the puck the entire series and got luckier w/ his scrambling than Lu. The Canucks failed to crash the net, get in his sight lines like they did with Quick the previous series and did absolutely nothing w/ the rebounds that were there. Contrast that with what Luongo faced. Lu wasn't good but neither was Niemi and Luongo could have been the difference maker for us but he got very little help. Its far to simplistic to look at the stats/win-loss results and conclude Niemi outplayed Luongo. Perhaps he did but it was marginal at best.
Island Nucklehead wrote:Bieksa... ohhh what to do with you? Forget trading him for anything with "young, potential" associated with it. MY hope, is that Bieksa is resigned to a lower cap-hit. I like his tenacity his "fuck you attitude" when he plays with it. With the likes of Salo, Edler, Ehrhoff this team is already dangerously soft on the back end. Fans are pissed with Bieksa because they expect him to play to a level he's not capable of on a consistent basis. Fine, I say adjust his salary for another year or two. Give us a number four guy who is paid as such and I think things will be a lot better. The only way we move KB is if we take back salary (re: underachiever).
My issue with Bieksa is will he ever play with that edge again? Will he ever put together a smart game longterm? The guy plays like a pussy half the time and no one is scared of his glare....no one is scared of him glaring *and* grabbing their jersey. When he played tough and on the smartish side he was a formidable force for us back there...he was our only blueliner who was mean back there. Perhaps injuries have gotten to him and messed w/ his head. I wouldn't be adverse to trading him but it would create a void as I can't think of anything we have to replace him with....problem is, if he doesn't play with an edge then we won't be missing anything we already didn't have. Thing is, can he get that toughness back? I'm sceptical to say the least.

I'd like to see a few things changed.

A tough energy crash 4th line much in the style of our '94 team. Antoski-MacIntyre-Hunter. Those guys used to start the game and soften the other team up....they could skate and man could they ever hit. We need a solid defensive player who can kill penalties (perhaps Johnson can still fit the bill) and 2 wingers who can skate and hit like mofos. Rypien could be one of them so realistically we need an upgrade over Hordichuk.....since we've got a fighter and a checker we need the ultimate banger who has wheels. Who that is I don't know but thats Gillis' job to find him. I know its not Grabner, Hansen, Demitra or Bernier.

The 3rd line center spot should be Hodgson's to loose. We know what we have with Wellwood and there is no upside there. Enough of the posturing crap, Hodgson is a blue chip prospect, its time he is shown some respect by this organization. The sky is the limit with him, do the right thing with him. The Sedins made the team before they were ready, and they were given every opportunity to succeed....look at them now.

Time to give Schnieder the backup role and let him play 20+ games to give Lu some relief. If Luongo can't get his game back then at least you have someone coming up through the system who can potentially challenge for that spot. If Lu does find his game and Schnieder proves he's the real deal THEN you have some serious trade bait. Either way its a win-win situation and regardless of which goalie the team eventually moves (most likely Schnieder) we'll get a decent return coming our way. Either way Schnieder is an asset & needs the opportunity to show he can deliver. The salary saving jig is up; he can no longer be returned to the minors so the Canucks hand will be forced and my money is on them not resigning Raycroft as there's no value there in terms of potential or trade return.

FINALLY time for a BOLD move. If I was Gillis I'd make a run at a winger like Lucic or in that mold and do my best to make that deal happen...who knows, after their collapse the Bruins might be in the mood for a shakeup. Naturally that would cost significantly but thats the type of winger this team needs. If not Lucic, someone in that vein. Gillis is the guy who said he was going to be the opposite of Nonis and make "bold" moves. Well this, or something of that ilk, would fit the bill.

Revamp the blueline. Edler & most likely Ehrhoff aren't going anywhere, Salo has a NTC so that will be rode out. Alberts should be packed to Manitoba and used as relief help or relegated to the 7th spot. I don't mind Alberts as long as its spot duty. Worse than all those dumb penalties to me was that ridiculous backhand up the middle in the slot where TWO Hawks were swooping in (I'm sure he kissed Lu's butt in the dressing room over that save). If Alberts can be moved or dispatched to the farm team then Rome could easily fill that 7 spot. If and I mean IF Mitchell is healthy and would come back at a reasonable price then I'd bring him back. He brings a steady defensive presence we really need. If the price is too hefty I'd rather take a chance on Volchenkov or someone like that. I'd bring Baumgartner back (is his deal up?) as a depth guy in Manitoba again and if we run into injury issues again. Guy is fairly solid and despite getting out muscled he is above average w/ his outlet passes and brings some offence to the table. Rome should be retained as a depth blueliner but should not fit into our top 6 or else it will be a long season. So if its him & Alberts as our 7 & 8 guys w/ Baumer as 9 we'll be ok for depth.

That brings me to Bieksa & O' Brien...clearly updating our blueline is much easier said than done. Bieksa has no NTC so if he should be moved only if a physical mobile blueliner can be brought in. I have no faith he'll ever play w/ the same toughness he used to....unless there's an injury reason that we don't know about. That said, he could use a change in scenery. Before the playoffs I'd say O' Brien should be cut loose after his boozing antics and lack of training/professionalism. In the playoffs he showed guts and I loved his emotion. If his spot can upgraded then Gillis should bid adieu but otherwise he's earned his spot on this team and deserves a second chance. I think he still has upside that is yet untapped.

Whats out there via free agency that fits into our cap structure? Who's out there via the trade market? This is not going to be an easy task for Gillis but it is nevertheless an essential one. Its possible even Ehrhoff may have to be moved (if he can be upgraded and he def has more trade value now - and you have to give to get) in order to pull this job off but this is imo GIllis' most important task this summer.
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Re: WHERE do the Canucks go from here? List your strategies

Post by Madcombinepilot » Sun May 16, 2010 5:43 pm

Rypien could be one of them so realistically we need an upgrade over Hordichuk.....
I agree totally!! I love Hordi, keep as the guy who suits up vs Calgary and Chicago, but I would love to see a Steve Downey type for the 4th line..

I like the idea of adding a Lucic as well.. prolly too much for him though...
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Re: WHERE do the Canucks go from here? List your strategies

Post by the toucan kid » Sun May 16, 2010 5:50 pm

I like the idea of adding a Lucic as well.. prolly too much for him though...
No reason to think Boston would even consider moving him. Who wouldn't want him, though.

trouble

Re: WHERE do the Canucks go from here? List your strategies

Post by trouble » Sun May 16, 2010 9:11 pm

Here are afew UFA come July 1st that have some toughness

Manny Malhotra $700,000
Center
Born May 18 1980 -- Mississauga, ONT
Height 6.02 -- Weight 210 -- Shoots L


Krys Barch $575,000
Right Wing
Born Mar 26 1980 -- Hamilton, ONT
Height 6.01 -- Weight 222 -- Shoots L

Raffi Torres $2,750,000
Left Wing
Born Oct 8 1981 -- Toronto, ONT
Height 6.00 -- Weight 218 -- Shoots L

Tomas Holmstrom $2,250,000
Left Wing
Born Jan 23 1973 -- Pitea, Sweden
Height 6.00 -- Weight 198 -- Shoots L

Jody Shelley $725,000
Left Wing
Born Feb 7 1976 -- Thompson, MAN
Height 6.03 -- Weight 225 -- Shoots L

Targeting players like Holmstrom, Malhotra and Torres add some skill aswell.. Shelly and Barch are just goons

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Re: WHERE do the Canucks go from here? List your strategies

Post by woodhog » Sun May 16, 2010 10:56 pm

Malholtra is the only one off Troubles list that interests me. He could be the 3rd line center that we need.
Torres would be a good 3rd line winger but is way overpriced.

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Re: WHERE do the Canucks go from here? List your strategies

Post by Madcombinepilot » Mon May 17, 2010 2:22 am

not to be the sour pus... but I totally decline Manny Malhotra.

If my brother didn't one up one of his one night stands......

nah. thats not the reason.

I met the dude. looked him square in the eye.. and.... he aint got 'it'.

That undefinable quality that there really isn't any words for, but whatever it is, he is lacking it....

yup. thats the reason why I don't want him on my team.
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Re: WHERE do the Canucks go from here? List your strategies

Post by the toucan kid » Mon May 17, 2010 2:51 pm

I met the dude. looked him square in the eye.. and.... he aint got 'it'.
Of course not, he's a fourth line center...

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Re: WHERE do the Canucks go from here? List your strategies

Post by Madcombinepilot » Mon May 17, 2010 3:31 pm

I mean imo, he is a guy who will quit on the team, not that he is a superior hockey player.

Nothing like RJ.
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Re: WHERE do the Canucks go from here? List your strategies

Post by Fred » Tue May 18, 2010 11:50 am

So here's my choice

Defense
Hamhuis ( 6' / 205 ) and Shaone Morrisonn ( 6' 4" / 215) both URFA

Forwards
Colby Armstrong & Aaron Asham. Both rugged players that can play a regular shift

Players I would like to see moved Bernier,Rome, Glass, Wellwood and maybe O'Brien ( not a stable guy on or off the ice IMO) who knows about Johnson he's starting to a breakable player and I'm not sure he can keep it up much longer. In addition to Demitra and Mitchell who IMO are toast any way.
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Re: WHERE do the Canucks go from here? List your strategies

Post by Island Nucklehead » Tue May 18, 2010 12:23 pm

Fred wrote:So here's my choice

Defense
Hamhuis ( 6' / 205 ) and Shaone Morrisonn ( 6' 4" / 215) both URFA

Forwards
Colby Armstrong & Aaron Asham. Both rugged players that can play a regular shift

Players I would like to see moved Bernier,Rome, Glass, Wellwood and maybe O'Brien ( not a stable guy on or off the ice IMO) who knows about Johnson he's starting to a breakable player and I'm not sure he can keep it up much longer. In addition to Demitra and Mitchell who IMO are toast any way.
Don't mind those choices one bit... but how you're going to fit them under the salary cap is another matter.

Hamhuis: is going to cost $4M. Remember, it's not what the player is worth, it's what the other teams are willing to pay him. Looking at a deal like Komisarek got... his agent won't have a hard time arguing Hamhuis is worth 4.

Armstrong: former 20-goal scorer, capable of putting up 40 points. Made 2.4M last year and will probably require at least that much next season. Someone will give him three years and $8M. I wouldn't mind it be us, assuming we can dump Bernier. Would love Armstrong on this team.

Asham: definitely could use his size and sandpaper.

Morrisonn: another guy I wouldn't mind having. But again, he's probably looking at a raise, and we don't really need another depth defenseman making top four money.


The problem, as I see it, is that neither Hamhuis or Morrisonn are upgrades on Mitchell. I don't think either one is that offensively gifted that they can overcome what Willie brings on the defensive side of the puck. Obviously signing Willie is a big question mark, given his injury... but it might be worthwhile signing Willie at 2.5 over Hamhuis at 4+.

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Re: WHERE do the Canucks go from here? List your strategies

Post by Fred » Tue May 18, 2010 12:58 pm

Island Nucklehead wrote:
Don't mind those choices one bit... but how you're going to fit them under the salary cap is another matter.

Hamhuis: is going to cost $4M. Remember, it's not what the player is worth, it's what the other teams are willing to pay him. Looking at a deal like Komisarek got... his agent won't have a hard time arguing Hamhuis is worth 4.

Armstrong: former 20-goal scorer, capable of putting up 40 points. Made 2.4M last year and will probably require at least that much next season. Someone will give him three years and $8M. I wouldn't mind it be us, assuming we can dump Bernier. Would love Armstrong on this team.

Asham: definitely could use his size and sandpaper.

Morrisonn: another guy I wouldn't mind having. But again, he's probably looking at a raise, and we don't really need another depth defenseman making top four money.


The problem, as I see it, is that neither Hamhuis or Morrisonn are upgrades on Mitchell. I don't think either one is that offensively gifted that they can overcome what Willie brings on the defensive side of the puck. Obviously signing Willie is a big question mark, given his injury... but it might be worthwhile signing Willie at 2.5 over Hamhuis at 4+.
I see Mitchell as a injury prone player. So he's not even a possibility IMO, he's aging and still suffering serious injury, not a gamble I would take. I see both Hamhuis and Morrison as top 4 players.

Armstrong maybe his best days are passed him & Asham is certainly not worth more than a 1 year deal ( he made lesss than a million last season with the Flyers) but both have experience. Idon't see either as big money players Maybe trade to Bernier now ( he's a fixed salary) to Atalnta for Armstrong and get his rights to sign in the summer
cheers

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