Canucks News n Notes 22-23

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Ronning's Ghost
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Re: Canucks News n Notes 22-23

Post by Ronning's Ghost »

Chef Boi RD wrote: Sun Jan 22, 2023 8:07 pm The ask should be “when do we start being concerned with the new crew?”

My concerns started ramping up when we realized - the Miller extension was a bad idea, the Lekkerimaki pick is a bust, and the Stillman trade was good awful.
I don't think the Miller signing will be proven to be a bad idea until and unless they have to add a sweetener to move the contract. It might already be that bad, but there's still a chance it isn't. I didn't love the signing, but I liked it better than losing him to free agency for nothing. If Tocchet decides he can't work with Miller and convinces management to flip him at the deadline for pick, that's still better than nothing at all, even if it was less than whatever they were being offered this time last year.

I think it's still too early to call Lekkerimaki a bust. The Stillman trade does not look like a win, but it's not in the top 20 worst for this organization -- maybe not even the top 50.

Personally, I became concerned when I heard the term "re-tool". I probably have re-tool PTSD -- or the fan analogue, anyway.

So for me, the time for "concerned" has already past.

It sounds like HW is ready to make her call by July 1st. That seems like less rope than we have given others, but it also makes sense in that there does not seem to be a clear departure from the policies of the previous administration.
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Chef Boi RD
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Re: Canucks News n Notes 22-23

Post by Chef Boi RD »

Ronning's Ghost wrote: Sun Jan 22, 2023 8:31 pm in that there does not seem to be a clear departure from the policies of the previous administration.
What would be your observation as to why this is? The similarities so to speak? Why the continuation? Especially if the “policies” of the previous GM were wrong… according to his critics? Were those policies his or of those higher up in the pecking order of where the buck stops? Must be if there is no departure from those policies, that GM is no longer here pushing those policies
Last edited by Chef Boi RD on Sun Jan 22, 2023 9:01 pm, edited 6 times in total.
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Re: Canucks News n Notes 22-23

Post by Topper »

Hockey Widow wrote: Sun Jan 22, 2023 8:05 pm Don’t you love how Rutherford threw owners under the bus? When defending his handling of the Bruce situation he said he don’t think he acted any differently than other GMs or people in power. He used the hiring of Bruce and firing of Green by Aqualung as an examples. He said ownership was already talking to Bruce and hired him before they fired Travis. I lol at that one.
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Re: Canucks News n Notes 22-23

Post by BladesofSteel »

Let’s be perfectly clear about the Stillman trade. Management didn’t overestimate Stillmans value in dealing a 2nd round pick to acquire him. They needed cap space and were trying to dump an egregious signing in Jason Dickinson, who was on the books for two more seasons.

The 2nd round pick was the cost of dumping 2x $2.65 mil, while Stillman was the contract added to make the money work.

For context, Holland had to spend a 2nd, a 3rd and drop three spots in last years 1st round just to dump Kassians $3.2mil final two seasons. A mere 550k more than JD.

Salary HAD to be moved, and a 2nd was the cost of business.
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Re: Canucks News n Notes 22-23

Post by Ronning's Ghost »

Chef Boi RD wrote: Sun Jan 22, 2023 8:53 pm
Ronning's Ghost wrote: Sun Jan 22, 2023 8:31 pm in that there does not seem to be a clear departure from the policies of the previous administration.
What would be your observation as to why this is? The similarities so to speak? Why the continuation? Especially if the “policies” of the previous GM were wrong… according to his critics? Were those policies his or of those higher up in the pecking order of where the buck stops? Must be if there is no departure from those policies, that GM is no longer here pushing those policies
The seems to be the prevailing theory on this board. It's hard to know for sure, but it's consistent with what we can observe.
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Re: Canucks News n Notes 22-23

Post by Chef Boi RD »

BladesofSteel wrote: Sun Jan 22, 2023 9:15 pm Let’s be perfectly clear about the Stillman trade. Management didn’t overestimate Stillmans value in dealing a 2nd round pick to acquire him. They needed cap space and were trying to dump an egregious signing in Jason Dickinson, who was on the books for two more seasons.

The 2nd round pick was the cost of dumping 2x $2.65 mil, while Stillman was the contract added to make the money work.

For context, Holland had to spend a 2nd, a 3rd and drop three spots in last years 1st round just to dump Kassians $3.2mil final two seasons. A mere 550k more than JD.

Salary HAD to be moved, and a 2nd was the cost of business.
Had they traded Miller for Chytil, Lundqvist and NYR’s first like they should’ve Dickinson’s contract wouldn’t need moving and Bo would be signed? No?
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Re: Canucks News n Notes 22-23

Post by Ronning's Ghost »

Chef Boi RD wrote: Sun Jan 22, 2023 10:01 pm Had they traded Miller for Chytil, Lundqvist and NYR’s first like they should’ve Dickinson’s contract wouldn’t need moving and Bo would be signed? No?
If that really was the offer, they were crazy not to jump on it, and the contract looks worse by comparison with that alternative.

What are the sources on that?
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Re: Canucks News n Notes 22-23

Post by Hockey Widow »

There are no sources on that. Just rumour and hound dogging it
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Chef Boi RD
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Re: Canucks News n Notes 22-23

Post by Chef Boi RD »

Ronning's Ghost wrote: Sun Jan 22, 2023 10:24 pm
Chef Boi RD wrote: Sun Jan 22, 2023 10:01 pm Had they traded Miller for Chytil, Lundqvist and NYR’s first like they should’ve Dickinson’s contract wouldn’t need moving and Bo would be signed? No?
If that really was the offer, they were crazy not to jump on it, and the contract looks worse by comparison with that alternative.

What are the sources on that?
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Re: Canucks News n Notes 22-23

Post by Meds »

According to the Penguins thread on reddit Rutherford was known there for liking his elite core guys and cultivating some relationship there, but everyone else was just so much fodder.

He loved making trades, and when he ran out of trades he tried to move Letang. Lemieux vetoed it and Rutherford quit.

This is gonna be sooooo much fun. :?

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Re: Canucks News n Notes 22-23

Post by Strangelove »

BladesofSteel wrote: Sun Jan 22, 2023 9:15 pm Let’s be perfectly clear about the Stillman trade. Management didn’t overestimate Stillmans value in dealing a 2nd round pick to acquire him. They needed cap space and were trying to dump an egregious signing in Jason Dickinson, who was on the books for two more seasons.

The 2nd round pick was the cost of dumping 2x $2.65 mil, while Stillman was the contract added to make the money work.

For context, Holland had to spend a 2nd, a 3rd and drop three spots in last years 1st round just to dump Kassians $3.2mil final two seasons. A mere 550k more than JD.

Salary HAD to be moved, and a 2nd was the cost of business.
Great point, but for the love of God why didn't they just bury Stillperson in Abby...
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Re: Canucks News n Notes 22-23

Post by CrzyCanuck »

Am I the only one who's happy to see Gonchar and Foote behind our bench? finally some legit assholes to teach our young players to be mean
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Re: Canucks News n Notes 22-23

Post by rikster »

Hockey Widow wrote: Sun Jan 22, 2023 8:05 pm Don’t you love how Rutherford threw owners under the bus? When defending his handling of the Bruce situation he said he don’t think he acted any differently than other GMs or people in power. He used the hiring of Bruce and firing of Green by Aqualung as an examples. He said ownership was already talking to Bruce and hired him before they fired Travis. I lol at that one.
The hiring process wasn't out of the ordinary, whether it be in the real world or in the sports world...

While I didn't agree with Rutherford publicly criticizing the coach over his inability or refusal to fix the glaring weaknesses in the teams play, we all saw it and we all complained about it...

The players, for all of their support following his firing didn't look like a team playing to save a coaches job, so I don't put much stock into much of what they say now...

The media is up in arms over how this was handled, but they are the ones who chose to spend most of their shows speculating on when and who for days and weeks and months all in the name of ratings and clicks...

If the coach was a Torts or someone not as well liked, would the outcry be as loud as it is?

The coach needed to go, that there is no doubt about...

In the end it came down to BB refusing to quit and forcing the team to fire him and pay him the balance of his contract ...while BB won the tug of war was he really thinking of his players over his own self interests?...

Moving forward, this may turn out to be one of the best management/coaching groups the organizations has had since the days of Quinn and Burke.
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Re: Canucks News n Notes 22-23

Post by Lancer »

Strangelove wrote: Mon Jan 23, 2023 2:43 pm
BladesofSteel wrote: Sun Jan 22, 2023 9:15 pm Let’s be perfectly clear about the Stillman trade. Management didn’t overestimate Stillmans value in dealing a 2nd round pick to acquire him. They needed cap space and were trying to dump an egregious signing in Jason Dickinson, who was on the books for two more seasons.

The 2nd round pick was the cost of dumping 2x $2.65 mil, while Stillman was the contract added to make the money work.

For context, Holland had to spend a 2nd, a 3rd and drop three spots in last years 1st round just to dump Kassians $3.2mil final two seasons. A mere 550k more than JD.

Salary HAD to be moved, and a 2nd was the cost of business.
Great point, but for the love of God why didn't they just bury Stillperson in Abby...
Yeah, Stillborn should marinate with the likes of Rathbone, Podz and Hoglander in Abby if they thought he had promise and potential. The fact he's with the big club and helping them suck while they're at it can lead one to assume that: a) He was a throw-in to a cap-centric trade in order to have an extra body on the blueline; and/or b) management does not see him being any better than he already is.

In a tanking season, he's just what the doctor ordered. Once they have some homegrown replacements ready in a couple years, they can heave-ho him to the pro hockey junk heap and see which rats may want to claim him.

On a side-note, kinda disheartening to be one of those guys who (if they're a tad self-aware) know the only reason they're in the bigs is because management wants to lose games. You are an NHL loser who, once the team is ready to win, will be chucked aside without a shred of sentiment. You will be looked upon in club and league history as some stiff whose only contribution was helping them lose.

But they get some sweet coin doing it, I guess.
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Re: Canucks News n Notes 22-23

Post by Megaterio Llamas »

Love to hear the Toronto media ripping Mr Aquilini.

Hearing the eastern media, even American media types like Frank Seravalli laying into Mr Aquilini just does a long suffering Canucks fan's heart good.

For the first time in ten years I have hope.




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