Trade rumours & armchair pipe dreams 19-20 Sponsored by SKYO

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BCExpat
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Curmudgeon wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 9:13 pm If they're still trying to add a RHD and the younger offer sheet type isn't going to happen, I wonder if they have any chance with Hamonic? He played the second most minutes on the Flames defense last season and logged a fair bit on the pk which would offset the Tanev loss.
Hamonic will bring many of the qualities that Tanev has. He's a heart and soul type, defensive D man.
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BCExpat wrote: Fri Oct 16, 2020 10:41 am
Curmudgeon wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 9:13 pm If they're still trying to add a RHD and the younger offer sheet type isn't going to happen, I wonder if they have any chance with Hamonic? He played the second most minutes on the Flames defense last season and logged a fair bit on the pk which would offset the Tanev loss.
Hamonic will bring many of the qualities that Tanev has. He's a heart and soul type, defensive D man.
I actually kind of hope we sign him, obviously for less than Tanev got, would also be happy with Fattenberg returning on the cheap.
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Post by theman »

BCExpat wrote: Fri Oct 16, 2020 10:37 am
Micky wrote: Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:33 am
The Brown Wizard wrote: Fri Oct 16, 2020 7:50 am Van has to be considered a contender out of the west now. 4 excellent top end fwds, 2 excellent top end dmen and a league best calibre duo in net.

Giggity

(oh and no Turnover Troy!)
Flames will be easy for the Canucks to beat. Be like practice. Score at will. Vegas will be a target for on-ice barbs thanks to new info.
Blues lost their heart and soul. Denver will choke, so will Dallas. California Golden teams are nowhere.

Whatever the format chosen to play this year, the Canucks will probably not be as challenged with a travel schedule and we can take advantage of that and better our round two playoff performance last season.
While I really like the young core the Canucks have, I don't think that beating the flames will be easy. I think they will split the games they play each other. Calgary still has a pretty good offense, the D is probably better than the Canucks and at the very least, they have as good if not better goaltending. Although each team has different strengths and weaknesses, I view them as about equal at this point.
The past few years the Flames have been a strange team, never the sum of their parts. Markstrom is a great signing for them, and Tanev too, although I have been telling my Flames neighbours that be prepared to see Tanev out of the line up for around 30% of his contract, could be higher next season with such a compressed schedule.
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theman wrote: Fri Oct 16, 2020 10:44 am The past few years the Flames have been a strange team, never the sum of their parts. Markstrom is a great signing for them, and Tanev too, although I have been telling my Flames neighbours that be prepared to see Tanev out of the line up for around 30% of his contract, could be higher next season with such a compressed schedule.
I definitely agree with this. I think the biggest problem is that the top line isn't as good as it should be. I think Gaudreau is cast into a role of carrying the top line. If he is to remain on the top line, they need to get him a big, talented 1C and that is almost impossible in the trade market without giving up the farm. They have Dillon Dube who looks promising and is progressing well and they did draft a pretty decent centre in Connor Zary, but he is a few years away from the NHL - by that time, Gaudreau will be gone. I think they need to trade him before the next season starts.

The forward core is pretty decent, with Tkachuk, Monahan, Lindholm, Gaudreau, Mangiapane and Dube. If they can get a top 6 forward for Gaudreau, who has some size and skill (maybe not Gaudreau's skill level), then they will be fine.
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Agree. Monahan to me is a 2C who can play 1C, he is not a true 1C, unlike Pettersson who is. Gaudreau is best to play off a more dominate C or LW. It is a bad balance the Flames have in their top 6. They also don't have a true 2C that can take the heat off of Monahan too.
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theman wrote: Fri Oct 16, 2020 10:59 am Agree. Monahan to me is a 2C who can play 1C, he is not a true 1C, unlike Pettersson who is. Gaudreau is best to play off a more dominate C or LW. It is a bad balance the Flames have in their top 6. They also don't have a true 2C that can take the heat off of Monahan too.
Monahan is definitely a 2C. Backlund should be a 3C. The Flames have had trouble getting a true 1C back to Iggy's days as a Flame.
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ESQ wrote: Thu Oct 15, 2020 7:14 pm I've always assumed from your alma mater that you possibly live somewhere that is within the Avalanche "catchment" for media coverage, as you are extremely knowledgeable about the team.
I'm from a different UW. Three hints: Danny Heatley, Brian Rafalski, Joe Pavelski.

I get the NHL.TV through the NHL app. Used to get the NHL package through cable or satellite when I had those dinosaurs. The only teams I can't watch are those in my media area. This is how I watch the Canucks.

But I get to see all of the NHL games expect for the one team that is in my hockey media market. Other teams I enjoy watching change over time, but Tampa is always on the list and Colorado has been the since McKinnon started clicking on all cylinders. I just think the way he plays is highly entertaining and quite unique -- his unique crossover, his ability to shoot with power in stride and from the "wrong" foot, the speed and unpredictability of his decisionmaking. For Tampa, the player I love to watch closely is Kucherov. His skating is underrated (because he's not flying 200 feet) and extraordinarily deceptive. He has the ability to "present" himself in his hockey position without giving away where he is placing his weight -- defenders can figure out if he's going to pivot in, pivot out, take a short sprint, etc. Its so subtle and expert.....
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BCExpat wrote: Fri Oct 16, 2020 11:06 am
theman wrote: Fri Oct 16, 2020 10:59 am Agree. Monahan to me is a 2C who can play 1C, he is not a true 1C, unlike Pettersson who is. Gaudreau is best to play off a more dominate C or LW. It is a bad balance the Flames have in their top 6. They also don't have a true 2C that can take the heat off of Monahan too.
Monahan is definitely a 2C. Backlund should be a 3C. The Flames have had trouble getting a true 1C back to Iggy's days as a Flame.
That's because they have never built from within.....at least not in recent memory. They end up with a dominant player or two and then try to sign free agents and pull the trigger on trades for 2nd and 3rd liners without actually cementing those 3 key positions (1C, 1D, 1G).

In 2004 the Flames had that Cinderella run to the Finals and were immediately heralded as the favourites when the NHL returned to play in 2005-06 after the lost season. They hadn't improved, and while were a solid regular season team finishing 7th overall, they scored 218 goals, good for 28th overall. But this team was a favourite to win everything, and management drank the Kool-Aid. They got bounced in the 1st round for the next 4 years.

I mean, they tried to build around a winger by giving him Craig Conroy and David Legwand for a top line center. The didn't have the chips in hand to actually trade for anything good without gutting the existing roster, and the prospect cupboards were barren.

Alberta teams are polar opposites in terms of ways to not build a consistent contender. :lol:
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Meds wrote: Fri Oct 16, 2020 9:03 pm
BCExpat wrote: Fri Oct 16, 2020 11:06 am
theman wrote: Fri Oct 16, 2020 10:59 am Agree. Monahan to me is a 2C who can play 1C, he is not a true 1C, unlike Pettersson who is. Gaudreau is best to play off a more dominate C or LW. It is a bad balance the Flames have in their top 6. They also don't have a true 2C that can take the heat off of Monahan too.
Monahan is definitely a 2C. Backlund should be a 3C. The Flames have had trouble getting a true 1C back to Iggy's days as a Flame.
That's because they have never built from within.....at least not in recent memory. They end up with a dominant player or two and then try to sign free agents and pull the trigger on trades for 2nd and 3rd liners without actually cementing those 3 key positions (1C, 1D, 1G).

In 2004 the Flames had that Cinderella run to the Finals and were immediately heralded as the favourites when the NHL returned to play in 2005-06 after the lost season. They hadn't improved, and while were a solid regular season team finishing 7th overall, they scored 218 goals, good for 28th overall. But this team was a favourite to win everything, and management drank the Kool-Aid. They got bounced in the 1st round for the next 4 years.

I mean, they tried to build around a winger by giving him Craig Conroy and David Legwand for a top line center. The didn't have the chips in hand to actually trade for anything good without gutting the existing roster, and the prospect cupboards were barren.

Alberta teams are polar opposites in terms of ways to not build a consistent contender. :lol:
Well they do have a couple of guys who could end up being legit 1C guys in Dube and Zary. The problem is, they need someone now and those two guys aren't ready yet. Dube may be ready in a year or 2 (he's playing with the Flames now, but not ready to take over the 1C spot yet), Zary is probably 3 to 4 years away. So, they have drafted some decent centres in recent years. They have vastly improved their drafting since Treliving has taken over. It's going to take time - but he is on the right track. He is building a team that will be a contender eventually. So you can't go by what the Flames did before Treliving. That's not how they are operating now.

And please don't lump the Flames in with the Oilers. The Flames have NEVER had a 1st overall pick. The best they had was 4th overall. The Oilers should be in the middle of a dynasty with all the first overall picks and high draft picks they have had, yet they are still mediocre. How much longer will it be before McCovid asks for a trade?

Oh and, David Legwand was never a Flame.
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I’m not seeing no. 1 centre potential in Zary and Dube at all, unless you’re idea of a no. 1 centre is a lot less than what I think a no. 1 centre is

Legitimate No. 1 centre is a very tough position to fill, as it is with a legitimate no. 1 D-man and goalie. Canucks are well positioned in all 3 categories
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Chef Boi RD wrote: Sat Oct 17, 2020 10:18 am I’m not seeing no. 1 centre potential in Zary and Dube at all, unless you’re idea of a no. 1 centre is a lot less than what I think a no. 1 centre is
No nothing about Zary but Dube a 1C? maybe a 2C but will probably be a solid 3C.
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theman wrote: Sat Oct 17, 2020 10:20 am
Chef Boi RD wrote: Sat Oct 17, 2020 10:18 am I’m not seeing no. 1 centre potential in Zary and Dube at all, unless you’re idea of a no. 1 centre is a lot less than what I think a no. 1 centre is
No nothing about Zary but Dube a 1C?
Hell no. Decent player Dube but no. 1? Not even close. Maybe if you got amazing depth and a bunch of very good wingers
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Chef Boi RD wrote: Sat Oct 17, 2020 10:18 am I’m not seeing no. 1 centre potential in Zary and Dube at all, unless you’re idea of a no. 1 centre is a lot less than what I think a no. 1 centre is

Legitimate No. 1 centre is a very tough position to fill, as it is with a legitimate no. 1 D-man and goalie. Canucks are well positioned in all 3 categories
Agreed. Unless you’re going to develop a guy like Zibanajed who’s a huge rarity, Yu can pretty much identify these legit #1 centres within 3 years of being drafted. Dube looks like he may be a decent 2nd line guy, but I don’t see a #1 pivot. I think if Zary had that projection he would have went a lot higher in the recent draft. When I look around at 90 % of legitimate top line centres they’ve all produced a year or three after being drafted. McJesus, Mackinnon, Eichel, Tavares, Matthews, Draisaitl, Pettersson, Aho, Barzal, Barkov, Getzlaf, Seguin and probably a couple more. Other than Zibanjed and ROR, I can’t think of any late bloomers they have become impact players.

I mean, they could pull a rabbit out of a hat with one of these guys, but nailing a top 5 or 8 pick or two can be a real game changer. Flames are getting some decent depth and now they have a high end goalie. They will be a playoff team next year, but not a contender.
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I don't see the Flames being a contender with the current core. That being said, I didn't think the Stars were a contender either, but they made the SCF, so who knows.

It was a deep draft this year, so that is why Zary dropped to the Flames. He may not end up being a Mckinnon or one of the guys of Doyle's list but he should be pretty decent as a 1C. Then again, he might just fall off into the abyss.
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BCExpat wrote: Sat Oct 17, 2020 10:14 am
Meds wrote: Fri Oct 16, 2020 9:03 pm
BCExpat wrote: Fri Oct 16, 2020 11:06 am
theman wrote: Fri Oct 16, 2020 10:59 am Agree. Monahan to me is a 2C who can play 1C, he is not a true 1C, unlike Pettersson who is. Gaudreau is best to play off a more dominate C or LW. It is a bad balance the Flames have in their top 6. They also don't have a true 2C that can take the heat off of Monahan too.
Monahan is definitely a 2C. Backlund should be a 3C. The Flames have had trouble getting a true 1C back to Iggy's days as a Flame.
That's because they have never built from within.....at least not in recent memory. They end up with a dominant player or two and then try to sign free agents and pull the trigger on trades for 2nd and 3rd liners without actually cementing those 3 key positions (1C, 1D, 1G).

In 2004 the Flames had that Cinderella run to the Finals and were immediately heralded as the favourites when the NHL returned to play in 2005-06 after the lost season. They hadn't improved, and while were a solid regular season team finishing 7th overall, they scored 218 goals, good for 28th overall. But this team was a favourite to win everything, and management drank the Kool-Aid. They got bounced in the 1st round for the next 4 years.

I mean, they tried to build around a winger by giving him Craig Conroy and David Legwand for a top line center. The didn't have the chips in hand to actually trade for anything good without gutting the existing roster, and the prospect cupboards were barren.

Alberta teams are polar opposites in terms of ways to not build a consistent contender. :lol:
Well they do have a couple of guys who could end up being legit 1C guys in Dube and Zary. The problem is, they need someone now and those two guys aren't ready yet. Dube may be ready in a year or 2 (he's playing with the Flames now, but not ready to take over the 1C spot yet), Zary is probably 3 to 4 years away. So, they have drafted some decent centres in recent years. They have vastly improved their drafting since Treliving has taken over. It's going to take time - but he is on the right track. He is building a team that will be a contender eventually. So you can't go by what the Flames did before Treliving. That's not how they are operating now.

And please don't lump the Flames in with the Oilers. The Flames have NEVER had a 1st overall pick. The best they had was 4th overall. The Oilers should be in the middle of a dynasty with all the first overall picks and high draft picks they have had, yet they are still mediocre. How much longer will it be before McCovid asks for a trade?

Oh and, David Legwand was never a Flame.
I was saying the Flames and Oilers are opposites. Flames haven't really drafted high but have tried to build through free agency and middling trades. Whereas the Coil keep trying to build with high picks and no real support. If you put the teams together you'd probably have a dynasty. :P

I mean Damon Langkow.
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