NHL business

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mr perfect
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Re: NHL business

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Mëds wrote: Sat Aug 21, 2021 10:20 am
SKYO wrote: Thu Aug 19, 2021 1:40 pm Selfishly I'd hope Portland, Oregon gets a NHL franchise so the Canucks could have a east coast team like travel schedule with Edm/Calgary/Van/Seattle/Portland all short distance travel.
No way. Now how.

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Re: NHL business

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I have no knowledge of the situation in Houston, whether an NHL team could play out of the same arena as the Rockets, if Mick is correct that the place is full of banks then there's money for season's tickets. But moving a team might hinge on the new TV deal with ESPN. AEG owns the arena in KC but the population is 2 million less than the greater Phoenix area which is less viewers and less advertising dollars. Same for Portland and Quebec. A second team in TO would generate a lot of TV revenue across Canada but not for ESPN which is the big TV partner now. I believe Bettman is correct in that Glendale isn't good for the NHL market, the hockey fans are in Scottsdale and no one wants to do the rush hour traffic out to Glendale 41 times a year. The preference is obviously to keep the team in greater Phoenix. That's Bettman's history. However if the team can't find a home there then moving them to a bigger potential market in Houston with a natural rivalry with the Dallas Stars might be the only option acceptable to ESPN and the BOG. At some point Mick the NHL owners will finally get fed up with propping up a money losing franchise and prefer relocation over expansion money.
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Re: NHL business

Post by Strangelove »

I think Vancouver could support a second franchise.

They should build a world class arena in the West End and move the team there.

The Stanley Park Coyotes. :mrgreen:
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Re: NHL business

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Strangelove wrote: Sat Aug 21, 2021 1:43 pm I think Vancouver could support a second franchise.

They should build a world class arena in the West End and move the team there.

The Stanley Park Coyotes. :mrgreen:
Lol.

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Could build the arena across from Celebrities, neighboring St. Paul's.

Celebrities Coyotes Coliseum.

Virtanen could be their first captain....
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Re: NHL business

Post by Carl Yagro »

A team in the West End would have to be more inclusive. It would be called the Rainbow Coyotes.

Something will be happening to your ass whether you're looking or not.

I could see Jake working as a bartend in the corporate boxes... gay for pay. It's not like his hockey job prospects are that good.
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Re: NHL business

Post by Blob Mckenzie »

Carl Yagro wrote: Sat Aug 21, 2021 2:19 pm A team in the West End would have to be more inclusive. It would be called the Rainbow Coyotes.

Something will be happening to your ass whether you're looking or not.

I could see Jake working as a bartend in the corporate boxes... gay for pay. It's not like his hockey job prospects are that good.
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Re: NHL business

Post by ESQ »

Vin Tanner wrote: Sat Aug 21, 2021 6:30 am So again why would the league want to jam up Houston more than any other potential city the Coyotes could go to?
Well, the thinking would go that a Houston team is eating in to Dallas' market, so the relocation fee is to compensate primarily the stars ownership.

Personally, the thought of any Dallas stars fans being in Houston seems awfully far fetched, so the fee to move in would be a pittance, relative to buying Canadian territory.

Which begs the question: if the territory is worth so little, why move a failing franchise there instead of a market where someone will pay hundreds of millions of dollars and be profitable immediately?
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Re: NHL business

Post by Mickey107 »

Vin Tanner wrote: Sat Aug 21, 2021 2:22 pm
Carl Yagro wrote: Sat Aug 21, 2021 2:19 pm A team in the West End would have to be more inclusive. It would be called the Rainbow Coyotes.

Something will be happening to your ass whether you're looking or not.

I could see Jake working as a bartend in the corporate boxes... gay for pay. It's not like his hockey job prospects are that good.
Gomer could watch the games with a couple of black boys on his lap
I'm straight as they get. You, on the other hand "bring up" too much "stuff". Less is better. None is normal.
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Re: NHL business

Post by Strangelove »

Vin Tanner wrote: Sat Aug 21, 2021 2:22 pm
Carl Yagro wrote: Sat Aug 21, 2021 2:19 pm A team in the West End would have to be more inclusive. It would be called the Rainbow Coyotes.

Something will be happening to your ass whether you're looking or not.

I could see Jake working as a bartend in the corporate boxes... gay for pay. It's not like his hockey job prospects are that good.
Gomer could watch the games with a couple of black boys on his lap
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Re: NHL business

Post by Mickey107 »

Micky wrote: Sat Aug 21, 2021 2:35 pm
Vin Tanner wrote: Sat Aug 21, 2021 2:22 pm
Carl Yagro wrote: Sat Aug 21, 2021 2:19 pm A team in the West End would have to be more inclusive. It would be called the Rainbow Coyotes.

Something will be happening to your ass whether you're looking or not.

I could see Jake working as a bartend in the corporate boxes... gay for pay. It's not like his hockey job prospects are that good.
Gomer could watch the games with a couple of black boys on his lap
I'm straight as they get. You, on the other hand "bring up" too much "stuff". Less is better. None is normal. Strangelove on the other hand
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Re: NHL business

Post by Strangelove »

^ What's the deal with Gomer's obsession with gaiety?
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Re: NHL business

Post by Topper »

mr perfect wrote: Sat Aug 21, 2021 11:54 am I have no knowledge of the situation in Houston, whether an NHL team could play out of the same arena as the Rockets, if Mick is correct that the place is full of banks then there's money for season's tickets. But moving a team might hinge on the new TV deal with ESPN. AEG owns the arena in KC but the population is 2 million less than the greater Phoenix area which is less viewers and less advertising dollars. Same for Portland and Quebec. A second team in TO would generate a lot of TV revenue across Canada but not for ESPN which is the big TV partner now. I believe Bettman is correct in that Glendale isn't good for the NHL market, the hockey fans are in Scottsdale and no one wants to do the rush hour traffic out to Glendale 41 times a year. The preference is obviously to keep the team in greater Phoenix. That's Bettman's history. However if the team can't find a home there then moving them to a bigger potential market in Houston with a natural rivalry with the Dallas Stars might be the only option acceptable to ESPN and the BOG. At some point Mick the NHL owners will finally get fed up with propping up a money losing franchise and prefer relocation over expansion money.
Plenty of money in Houston, petrochem dollars. Urban sprawl is the mantra there, downtown is a dump and the nicer areas are scattered far and wide. Galleria possibly but also lots of development happening around George Bush international Airport.
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Re: NHL business

Post by ESQ »

Topper wrote: Sat Aug 21, 2021 6:49 pm
Plenty of money in Houston, petrochem dollars. Urban sprawl is the mantra there, downtown is a dump and the nicer areas are scattered far and wide. Galleria possibly but also lots of development happening around George Bush international Airport.
Shitloads of money, but not much interest in hockey.

Nhl would be behind NFL, MLB, college football, high school football, NBA...
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Re: NHL business

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ESQ wrote: Sat Aug 21, 2021 2:30 pm
Vin Tanner wrote: Sat Aug 21, 2021 6:30 am So again why would the league want to jam up Houston more than any other potential city the Coyotes could go to?
Well, the thinking would go that a Houston team is eating in to Dallas' market, so the relocation fee is to compensate primarily the stars ownership.

Personally, the thought of any Dallas stars fans being in Houston seems awfully far fetched, so the fee to move in would be a pittance, relative to buying Canadian territory.

Which begs the question: if the territory is worth so little, why move a failing franchise there instead of a market where someone will pay hundreds of millions of dollars and be profitable immediately?
Sure some Dallas fans could be in Houston, but Dallas is the closest team and I suppose there is a unique Texan identity.

But these cities are separated by 240 miles! Put in perspective, that's a bit further than the distance between Washington DC and New York. They don't share media, they don't share commuter towns, etc.

And the distance between DC and New York? The same as the distance between Vancouver and Seattle....

I think that the Nashville/Columbus/Tampa model was the perfect model for NHL expansion -- pick a city that is on the rise that does not have an NBA team to compete with. Columbus was perfect -- no NFL team or MLB team either. (And the Preds and Titans started at about the same time). Carolina is similar -- the NBA team and the NFL teams were a couple hours down the road, and Raleigh-Durham was rowing and today is booming, even more so than 25 years ago, and *without* Charlotte (a banking/finance city) it now has over 2 million in the metro area. Seattle is a variation on this approach, though its less a city on the rise and more a city whose rise a generation ago cemented it as a major US city (and also a wealthy one). That Seattle lacked an NBA team is just the product of a battle of chicken regarding public subsidies (why the North Stars left Minnesota in the early '90s while being one of the best hockey markets in the US at the time).

But are there US cities that look more like Columbus and Nashville a generation ago? I think Omaha could be one to watch out for down the line, but is currently just a bit too small. Growing hockey culture, fairly affluent, starved for a first tier pro franchise to be considered a first class city. Kansas City is growing (something short of booming, but definitely growing), and has the right metro population (for a city without an NBA team). Its about the same distance from St. Louis as Houston is to Dallas. I do think, however, that it is a city where the NBA would do better -- no Missouri-based NBA team.

So without a perfect NBA-free city, Houston makes a ton of sense now that the lowest hanging fruit (Seattle) is off the board. There is an NBA team there, but its a much larger market -- 7 million people to Seattle metros 4 million people. And do you know what market should be looked at next in my view? Atlanta. I know it failed twice. I know the last time it failed was only a decade ago. But the metro area has added about 720,000 people since then, with the city itself growing by about 25%. The trick about Atlanta is kind of the trick about Pheonix (and might be a trick about Houston which I know less about). It is a traffic nightmare and the wealth is not heavily clustered.

A decade is *starting* to be a long time as these things go. The Thrashers as a model weren't ideal. The team was terrible -- they scored more goals than they gave up only one time (and then only by one goal) and they made exactly one playoffs and won exactly zero playoff games. Its hard to market a terrible product, as the NHL learned when it tweaked the rules for the Vegas expansion.

And what's the worst that could happen if another Atlanta team fails? Canada gets an 8th team through relocation.....
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Re: NHL business

Post by Tciso »

Does the NHL really need any more teams? 32 is plenty, as we already have a watered down league.
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